The Charming, Amusing, Surprisingly Low-Confidence Matthew Rhys

**SPEAKER_1** (0:00)
This message is brought to you by AppleCard. Shave ice by the beach. A trip to the state fair.
And a throwback flick at the local drive-in.
They're more than just items to check off the summer bucket list. They're also opportunities to earn 2% daily cash back when you use your AppleCard with Apple Pay. Apply for AppleCard now and use in minutes with Apple Pay. Subject to credit approval, AppleCard is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch. Terms and more at applecard.com.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (0:34)
From The New York Times, this is the interview. I'm Lulu Garcia Navarro.
The actor Matthew Rhys is on a tear. He starred in this year's surprise breakout hit Widow's Bay, as a small town mayor trying desperately to bring tourism to his sleepy island, despite locals warning that the place is haunted. Rhys also starred in The Beast in Me as Nile Jarvis, a New York real estate developer rumored to have murdered his wife. Both of those parts won him Emmy nominations this year. Yes, he's nominated twice. But as I found out when we spoke, it doesn't mean he's feeling secure in his career. We got into that and talked about some of his other memorable roles and about his life with his partner Kerry Russell, who he fell in love with on the set of The Americans.
Here's my conversation with Matthew Rhys. But first, a quick message. If you're not a subscriber, we have some news for you. You can now explore The Times for free without paywalls during your first month in The New York Times app. Just download the app and we hope you enjoy it. Okay, on to the interview.
Matthew Rhys, thank you so much for being here.

**Matthew Rhys** (1:46)
Thank you for the invite.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (1:48)
So the best description of you that I've seen is actually your own.

**Matthew Rhys** (1:53)
Oh, God. Yes. Here we go. Yeah. Immediately panicked. All right.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (1:57)
You said once that you are, quote, eternally seeking to channel the spirit of David Niven, and that of course is referring to the great leading man who has Welsh roots. I discovered his autobiography, The Moon is a Balloon is one of my absolute favorite books in the world.

**Matthew Rhys** (2:11)
Agreed.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (2:12)
Can you tell me what you meant by that?

**Matthew Rhys** (2:15)
Yes. I feel my life or how I am in the world. I'm always really like a nervous Nellie, and I'm always like, oh my God, I said the wrong thing. I did the wrong thing. And then I look at Niven and he's always so quietly self-assured and calm and seemingly said the right thing, even when a naked person ran behind him at the Oscars. And I just wish I could be that person and say the right thing or and be gracious and effortless and always think of others. And every time you read of an actor who worked with David Niven, you always say he was just so gracious to everyone and thought of others all the time and said the right thing and was calm. And I was like, God, I wish I could be that person.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (2:59)
Yeah. It's interesting the way that you view him because he is witty and charming and always said the right thing, but also maybe a bit frivolous, maybe a bit.

**Matthew Rhys** (3:10)
Frivolous in what sense or with what?

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (3:13)
Well, I mean, you know, he was the perfect party guest. Yes. And in terms of his acting, he was a good actor. I wouldn't say a great actor.

**Matthew Rhys** (3:22)
I agree.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (3:23)
And when I think of your work, I think more of sort of the great Welsh actors, you know, Richard Burton and Anthony Hopkins and the OG Ray Milland, you know, who were sort of brooding dark characters. And so I guess what you're saying is David Niven in life and perhaps others in work?

**Matthew Rhys** (3:42)
Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And I would say that I would say Richard Burton is on par with Niven in that sense as to who I would aspire to be, because Burton seemingly, he was the first to kind of be very, very un-Welsh to me, which was arresting and inspiring.

**Lulu Garcia Navarro** (4:03)
What is un-Welsh?

**Matthew Rhys** (4:05)
I think we're a small country who have suffered for being England's neighbor, a small kind of cousin who's always ignored and put into the corner, and kind of told what to do by England. And they are for, I think there's a great kind of subservience and insecurity to a degree nationally. And he was one of the first to kind of really, with this great confidence and hubris going, I'm not going to be that. I'll take Hollywood by storm. I will challenge Onassis for the diamond.