Afghanistan five years after the Taliban return

**Oliver Conway** (0:00)
This is the Global News Podcast from the BBC World Service. Hello, I'm Oliver Conway, and this edition is published in the early hours of Friday, the 14th of August. Five years after the Taliban returned to power in Afghanistan, we have a special report on the restrictions they've imposed on women and girls. US Democrats demand answers about poor conditions on an aircraft carrier in the Gulf, and why America is executing more prisoners.
Also in this podcast, the climate of fear in Ghana after parliament votes to jail gay people.

**Alim Macbool** (0:37)
This legislation being passed in parliament has led to rhetoric that has left gay people here fearful. Some of them have fled the country.

**Emmanuel Bezra** (0:45)
They have to go. We don't want them there.

**Oliver Conway** (0:47)
And the benefits of jogging with a pushchair.
It is five years since the Taliban swept back into power in Afghanistan. And life for women and girls is still severely restricted. Girls can only attend school until grade six, around the age of 12 And women are barred from university and many jobs. There are even rules over visiting public parks and gyms. Our chief international correspondent, Lyse Doucet, has returned to Afghanistan to meet those trying to keep learning and working, despite what some call gender apartheid.

**Lyse Doucet** (1:28)
The sound of a school almost anywhere in the world. Afghan boys and girls in primary school laughing and learning with their teachers. But now we're going down a dark hallway into a far corner. And this is how young girls in Afghanistan, beyond grade 6, are being educated now. This is what's called a secret school.
Hello, salam alaykum.

**Alim Macbool** (1:56)
How are you? Are you okay?

**Lyse Doucet** (1:59)
So you teach the girls what to do if the morality police come? Yeah.

**Alim Macbool** (2:03)
This is one escape?

**Melissa Jenkins** (2:05)
Yeah, one escape door.

**Alim Macbool** (2:06)
One is, the second one is here.

**Lyse Doucet** (2:08)
Where do the girls go? Downstairs?

**SPEAKER_7** (2:10)
This is back of the...

**Lyse Doucet** (2:12)
So they escape out the back door. Did they ever catch you? No.
Why do you take this risk?

**Alim Macbool** (2:17)
Because I'm also father and I have girls also.

**Emmanuel Bezra** (2:22)
This is a risk for us also.

**Alim Macbool** (2:24)
I accept.

**Lyse Doucet** (2:25)
We're just going up the stairs now. Some other classrooms of the oldest girls studying here.

**SPEAKER_9** (2:31)
I'm 13 years old and it's two years and I'm studying in a secret school and we are so happy to have a school like this.

**Lyse Doucet** (2:39)
When you sit in the classroom, how does it make you feel?

**SPEAKER_9** (2:43)
First is the feel that I'm going to learn something. And after that, there's some fear that what will happen if they find us.

**Lyse Doucet** (2:51)
What do you fear? What could happen?

**SPEAKER_9** (2:53)
If they find us, maybe something happened for us and also for our school. But even with this fear, we're coming to study and learn something.

**Lyse Doucet** (3:04)
Sometimes you get sad?

**SPEAKER_9** (3:05)
Yeah. Sometimes I'm thinking that what will happen in the future. Sometimes I get sad. Yes, it's like sometimes this feeling is coming.

**Lyse Doucet** (3:14)
Where do you find hope?

**SPEAKER_9** (3:16)
From thinking about my future that maybe it will be good.

**Lyse Doucet** (3:19)
You're a very brave girl.

**SPEAKER_9** (3:22)
Thank you also.

**Lyse Doucet** (3:25)
We've driven about an hour from Kabul and come to this village where we're going to meet women who are learning how to make jam. It's one of the many enterprises that are being set up by Afghan women because it is one area where the Taliban seem to have no objections. What were you doing before the Taliban came to power during the Republic?

**SPEAKER_8** (3:49)
I was a university student during the Republic, and I was studying political science.
I completed six semesters of my studies there. I had only two semesters left.
That was when, unfortunately, the universities were close to girls.

**Lyse Doucet** (4:09)
And now it's been five years, you're learning to make jam. How does that feel?

**SPEAKER_8** (4:17)
If I cannot go to university, then I will find work. I knew that if I stayed at home, I would not make any progress or better myself. But I am 100% sad. I loved my degree, and I really wanted to finish it. When I apply for jobs and send my CV in or go to interviews, the first thing they ask is for my university certificate.
But I never got to one.

**Lyse Doucet** (4:46)