30 Issues in 30 Days: Immigration in the Governor's Race

Brian Lehrer (0:10)

Brian Lehrer on WNYC. We are in our 30 issues and 30 days election series. Let other media focus only on the polls and personalities. We are choosing an issue a day for 30 straight shows leading up to the election to help you be as informed a voter as you can be in this election season. For issues 17 through 19, we are picking an issue a day for the rest of this week from Tuesday night's debate on New York One, the only debate in the New York state governor's race between Governor Kathy Hochul and her Republican challenger, Nassau County Executive Bruce Blakeman. Today, it's 30 issues and 30 days, issue 18, the Marble Hill ice shooting as a new issue in the governor's race. The shooting of 28-year-old Oscar Belgaul happened one week ago today when ICE agents tried to pick him up even though he's out on parole and awaiting trial on drug charges. Here's how the co-moderator, Errol Lewis, framed the first question of the debate to Blakeman. You'll notice Blakeman doesn't answer the question that was asked, but this begins this two-minute exchange with Hochul. Again, Errol Lewis, the moderator, speaks first.

Errol Lewis (1:20)

Multiple reports suggest that ICE has cut its training time, lowered its hiring standards, and deployed masked agents in cities whose leaders don't want them there, in this case, with long guns in a crowded urban environment. And I guess the question is, are you comfortable with that?

Bruce Blakeman (1:36)

Kathy Hochul appealed to ICE to let this criminal out. The question that New Yorkers have to ask is, what was this guy doing in New York in the first place? It's because Kathy Hochul has made us a sanctuary state. Think about it, this guy came into the country illegally. He's been convicted of a crime. He's got pending charges for dealing drugs poisoned to our children. And he's a gang banger.

This is who Kathy Hochul is defending.

I had a cooperative agreement with ICE until Kathy Hochul said we could no longer cooperate with ICE. We got over 2,000 illegal migrants out of my county with criminal records ranging from rape, attempted murder, robbery, burglary, drug dealing, carjacking, gang activity.

And that's because we cooperated with ICE. And we didn't raid one school, one hospital, one daycare center or one church. If you cooperate with federal law enforcement, it makes for a safer community. That's what I did. Kathy Hochul has taken that ability away from us. That's why things like this happen.

Errol Lewis (2:48)

I had a question for you, Ms. Hochul, but I wanted to give you a chance to respond.

Kathy Hochul (2:51)

No, thank you. I think in his non-answer, he refused to condemn what ICE did. So he basically says in the state of New York, he'd be fine if ICE agents shoot into cars, shoot guns into vehicles, not knowing who's inside, and could have killed a five-year-old child. If that doesn't shock the conscience of everybody, and it should shock his conscience as well, then he says that's okay. That's how ICE is supposed to do it. I'll tell you what.

I oversee over 500 policing agencies in the state of New York. Over half a million arrests every year. That's not how you conduct yourself. ICE is out of control. It's out of control in Nassau County.

Bruce Blakeman (3:31)

Kathy, it never would have happened, but for your sanctuary policy.

Brian Lehrer (3:36)

Hochul and Blakeman from Tuesday Night's Debate on Issues Related to the Marvel Hill Shooting. We have more excerpts to play on this and on public safety generally, which that kind of segue into in their exchanges. We'll get analysis now and invite your questions and reactions with Jimmy Vielkind, New York State Issues Reporter for WNYC and Gothamist. Hi, Jimmy. Thanks for helping out with this.

Jimmy Vielkind (3:58)

Good morning, Brian. Happy to be here.

Brian Lehrer (4:00)

So that was the immigration debate in this race in a nutshell, in a way.

Wouldn't you say she says he won't condemn anything that ICE does no matter how brutal. He says they wouldn't be in that position if it weren't for the sanctuary law Hochul signed, that prohibits what he considers orderly transfer of suspected or convicted criminals who are also in the country illegally. Do you think this issue comes down to a matter of emphasis in that way, and which thing each voter finds more threatening?

Jimmy Vielkind (4:30)

I do think that's a good way to think about it. Obviously, Democrats are pointing to aggressive tactics by ICE agents both in New York and around the country. We were, of course, all shocked earlier this year by the shooting deaths of Alex Preddy and Renée Good in Minnesota. That really prompted New York state lawmakers and Governor Hochul to respond when enacting a very comprehensive bill to restrict what local police agencies can do to cooperate with federal immigration authorities. Democrats, including Governor Hochul, say ICE is out of control, and they particularly take issue with the fact that immigration enforcement is not focused on, as Donald Trump said, the worst of the worst. But it's ensnaring people who have jobs, who have loved ones and relatives, who have been in the United States for years, are now finding themselves subject to deportation proceedings. That is deeply unpopular.