Why Gypsy Rose Says Ken Urker Threatened Sole Custody

SPEAKER_1 (0:01)

This is Hidden Killers Live with Tony Brueski and Robin Drake.

Tony Brueski (0:08)

Ken Urker's body was still in Louisiana when his sister went to the US. Sun and called Gypsy a liar, and the fight hasn't stopped since. Autumn, the sister of Urker, says the relationship was over a month earlier, and Ken ended it, that he wanted to take Aurora, this is their child, home to Texas. Gypsy answered with text messages dated a month before his death, in which the two of them agree on joint custody and to skip the lawyers.

In between sits the prison phone call where Gypsy in her own voice describes putting a knife in his headboard. There's a 21-month-old girl at the center of this who just said daddy at a funeral home, and the question every mother listening is asking is, well, who gets to raise her now? Well, obviously mom. It doesn't go to the aunt. It doesn't go to the grandparents or the child. It, I'm not trying to be disrespectful of the poor child. She does not go to just somebody else because dad died of an overdose, or if that's what happened, we don't know the answer to that question.

Whose version of the breakup is true here? I mean, this is an odd, again, odd situation. They could have been in a break. They could have still loved each other, but were taken a moment, taken a breather, and all the statements Gypsy is making about him being the love of her life, blah, blah, blah, could be completely true. I mean, I'm not dismissing and saying that that's not accurate because they were on again, off again, it seems quite a bit. And this happened in an off again period. But when you have this sister that is, you can tell this sister, I'm guessing, wasn't a big fan of the relationship to begin with. The fact that when this happened, her immediate reaction is looking at her. That anger, that desire to get out as just as fast as Gypsy in front of the story. What does that tell you guys about her level of concern for her brother and the relationship that he was in?

Lisa (2:10)

I think it tells us that she's afraid of DV. We can say domestic violence, can't we?

Tony Brueski (2:15)

Yeah.

Lisa (2:16)

She's afraid of domestic violence towards her brother and towards her niece. I can see that she is scared of that. One of the things that you said that I want to go back to is that Aurora is not going to be given to the aunts, to the grandparents, to whatever. She's going to go to mom.

Aunts and grandparents can, however, sue through the court system to have Gypsy Rose declared not fit for motherhood or whatever and can get custody. But that is a long drawn out road that I wouldn't wish I'm my worst enemy.

Tony Brueski (2:56)

Because basically if you have a pulse and you're not actively hitting your child at the moment Child Protective Services shows up, you're an AOK parent.

SPEAKER_4 (3:08)

The start of your question really was like whose version do you believe of the two?

And I think we have to look at this kind of take a step back and I think again this is one of those situations where both sides could be true. Sometimes you look at just a normal relationship breakup in real life. And what do you have? You've got friends of this person who hear this part of the story. You've got friends of this person who hear their part of the story. And while they're very different, there are some aspects that come together and actually create the actual reason for the breakup. So I think we might be looking at a situation where it's a little bit of this, a little bit of that, bring it all together. Somewhere in the middle is probably the truth.

Lisa (3:49)

Isn't there a saying, something, there's your version, my version and the truth. It's usually in the middle.

SPEAKER_4 (3:55)

Yeah.

Tony Brueski (3:55)

And the truth is which the law will apply to.

SPEAKER_4 (3:59)

Correct.

Tony Brueski (4:00)

And that's, I guess that's the part that they're going to have to get to. Gypsy's been doing herself no favors with what has come out online. There is a prison call in her voice describing her stabbing his headboard.

Lisa (4:20)

That's domestic violence.

Tony Brueski (4:23)

That's a little angry right there. And then there's the video which has come out. We've seen that where she's cutting up an anniversary blanket or something that he gave her and saying this is what I think of you and she's destroying this gift. I mean, those sort of things, if this weren't Gypsy Rose, if this were, you know, Jim and Jane and they're going to custody court over their children, those would be things that get brought up and shown to the judge going, this is why I don't think this is a fit parent. And the judge is gonna have to weigh it. Just because Ken is dead doesn't mean that that's not gonna happen. And that's exactly what you were saying, Lisa, is yes, the family can step in with those pieces of evidence. I mean, this, people act out in all sorts of ways. The the violence in this was directed at a headboard. So I guess that's something that's good. It wasn't a human.