When friends drift apart or fall out, the self-blame and grief can hurt more than a breakup

Cao Zhikai (0:00)

Losing friends is also a really sad process, and it's something that we do sometimes grieve over. I think many people think that, oh, it's not like a romantic breakup thing, you know? So they just be like, ayah, just get over it.

See Kai Wen (0:19)

Are your friends' circles shrinking?

Sue-Ann Tan (0:21)

How do people find time to juggle work, life and friends?

See Kai Wen (0:24)

And why is it so hard to make friends as adults?

Sue-Ann Tan (0:26)

Let's talk about it.

See Kai Wen (0:27)

Hi, my name is Kai Wen.

Sue-Ann Tan (0:28)

And I'm Sue-Ann.

See Kai Wen (0:29)

And you're listening to Headstart On Record. Join us as we figure adulting out so you don't have to do it alone. Joining us today is Zhikai from Goodity Co.

Sue-Ann Tan (0:36)

Hi Zhikai!

Cao Zhikai (0:37)

Thank you for having me.

See Kai Wen (0:38)

You're welcome. Zhikai, you're a therapist who works with a lot of gen Z's like yourself, and also created some content on friendships, which is where we found you on TikTok, right? Okay, and so within those circles of like your secondary school, you're JC, like so you have seen those groups shrinking down, and do you all know why or like, why do people leave? Or is it because you argue? Or really it's time or what?

Cao Zhikai (1:02)

So those that I've had since I was in the younger days, now has become like really, really tight. And a couple of years ago, I've gone through like phases where, you know, I realized that who I was becoming can kind of like diverge from the dynamics that I used to have with a particular friend or a particular group of friends. And that's when I choose to actively like disengage from these friends lah. Yeah, so I think that's how my friend groups have been shrinking.

Sue-Ann Tan (1:35)

Wow, okay. Actually, I totally agree. Because I had the same experience, especially with secondary school friends.

Cao Zhikai (1:39)

Oh, really?

Sue-Ann Tan (1:39)

Because it's kind of like in secondary school, you are obviously not the same person that you were when you were 13, right?

See Kai Wen (1:44)

You first met each other. You better not be, yeah.

Sue-Ann Tan (1:46)

Yeah, actually, yeah, exactly.

See Kai Wen (1:47)

You better not be.

Sue-Ann Tan (1:49)

And yet, there are people who, I guess, kind of expect you to still be. And in a way, they fit you into that box, or they treat you in a way that is kind of patronizing because they still expect you to be that same 13-year-old. And I'm like, it's actually a good thing that someone has grown up or like, you know, come out of their shell. I think because like in secondary school, I was a very shy kid. And then after that, I kind of grew into myself. I found my own like people in uni.

So, when I meet the secondary school friends again, it's super awkward and you realize in a way it's super sad, but sometimes you outgrow certain people and maybe they outgrow you too and that's fine.

See Kai Wen (2:25)

I think this comes down to like diverging life values and diverging life directions. Because I think a lot of our secondary school friends, our friends from schooling days, we are all circumstantial friends. I mean, in a way.

Sue-Ann Tan (2:36)

Like you sat near each other.

See Kai Wen (2:37)

Correct. We sat near each other or we are the only... For me, it's the group of guys in class. You know, we were the jokers around.

Sue-Ann Tan (2:42)

You copy each other's homework.

See Kai Wen (2:43)

Yeah. And I think we didn't really like become friends because of ideals or dreams or whatever. And so moving on from that, I think then as we grow up, as we grow older, as we all started to find our footing in life, then do we have different expectations of our own friendships as well? And so if let's say, I think from my own experience, luckily, my group of friends, we all understood as we grow older, we all have different time commitments, family commitments, and then we couldn't just hang out so much anymore.

Cao Zhikai (3:17)

I was the friend that kind of like tried to MIA my secondary school friends.

See Kai Wen (3:23)

So this was a secondary school group circle?

Cao Zhikai (3:25)

Like one of them. So it was a secondary school group circle. Then, ha ha, confession time.

No, then it's like, because we were pretty tight, I would say it was a pretty small group. It was four of us or so. So it was a bit harder for me to ghost. Like when I tried to ghost, because I didn't want to like confront them directly.