TUC General Secretary Paul Nowak Talks Andy Burnham's Economic Agenda

**Caroline Hepker** (0:00)
Let's get more on the economic challenges that face Britain's next Prime Minister. Can Andy Burnham, who looks set to take over from Keir Starmer, help Britain escape weak activity, high debt and elevated borrowing costs? Joining us now is Paul Nowak, General Secretary of the Trades Union Congress, the TUC, the umbrella body for dozens of trade unions, many of whom are affiliated with Labour. Good to speak to you again, Paul.

**Paul Nowak** (0:24)
Morning, Caroline, good to speak to you.

**Caroline Hepker** (0:26)
Been speaking to the British Chambers of Commerce this morning. Obviously, they represent business. They've got a lot of the leaders, Rachel Reeves, speaking to them today. They employ millions of people in Britain. The BCC boss says that increasing taxes for business will be a road to ruin. But you do want more support for voters. What do you want to see from potentially Andy Burnham if he does become PM?

**Paul Nowak** (0:48)
Well, whoever is our next Prime Minister, and Andy Burnham at the moment is the only candidate, I want them to show from day one that they're on the side of work and people, their families and communities, and to set out an ambitious program in that first 100 days of a Labour government about what they're going to do to, yes, get our economy growing, but get our economy growing in a way that puts money in the pockets of working people. So there are a lot of things. I've got a long list of suggestions, Caroline, but just on that issue around tax. I mean, so for example, we think it's important, we've got a fully costed plan for the government to introduce a social tariff on energy bills.
Hard to think on a day like today where the sun is cracking the flags about the cost of heating, but we know in the autumn and winter, because of that conflict in Iran, lots of people are going to see big spikes in the bills. So support for low and middle income households, how can you pay for that? We think an increase in the bank surcharge, the bank levy on windfall profits can help the government do that. I think that would be the right thing to do to support families. I think it would help bring down inflation. And frankly, I think Britain's banks can afford it because they've been doing very well over the course of the last 18 months, two years, because we've been in a relatively high interest rates environment. They're the sort of policies, I think, that could make a massive difference to millions of people up and down the country.

**Stephen Carroll** (2:00)
When we spoke to the BCC, they said they wanted to have a discussion about the Employment Rights Act to make sure it works for business. Are you worried about elements of that act being rolled back?

**Paul Nowak** (2:10)
Well, I think it would be a real mistake for the government to roll back on the Employment Rights Act.
And we've seen it already. I mean, I think the new prime minister will have a short honeymoon period. And there will be lots of vested interests making the case for change this or that. And there will be some dodgy bosses out there who don't want to see improvements in employment rights. Now, where I would agree with the British Chambers of Commerce is that there's going to be lots of changes as a result of the Employment Rights Act. I think there's a responsibility on government to work with unions and employers to help employers understand those changes. But fundamentally, this is about making work pay for millions of working people. So whether that's giving a million people on zero hours contracts the right to guaranteed hours, whether that's making sure that people have access to sick pay, to flexible working, we're very clear. This is a package of measures that's good for working people. The government itself is clear that this could deliver a 13 billion pound boost to the UK economy in terms of productivity. And I would ask employers to get on board with that agenda. And final point on that, our post-election polling was very clear. It doesn't matter whether you voted reformer at the last election, Labour, Green, Conservative, people support improvements in employment rights. And I would hope that employers would respect that.

**Caroline Hepker** (3:17)
OK, a bank tax would be an absolute bombshell. But you know, Jamie Dimon, if you look at him, JP Morgan Chief, he has directly told Bloomberg recently that if there were to be an increase in terms of taxes on banks, that JP Morgan would scrap plans to invest billions in a new London headquarters in Canary Wharf. He said specifically that JP Morgan, in his words, we paid probably $10 billion in extra taxes by now. I don't think that's right or fair.