Trump’s Map Makeover, Milo’s Deportation, and Gwyneth’s AI Dinner Drama

**Kara Swisher** (0:00)
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**Jennifer Welch** (0:41)
I think it's trickle down kissassery. I mean, look at how these guys kiss Trump's ass. Now we have Gwyneth Paltrow kissing their ass, and it's just like shit's rolling downhill.

**Kara Swisher** (0:55)
Hi, everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher, and it's the final week of Godfrey August. My guest today is the co-host of the I've Had It podcast and iHIP News and author of the upcoming book, Not Today, Fascist. It's, of course, Jennifer Welch. Hey, Jennifer.

**Jennifer Welch** (1:19)
Hi, Kara. How are you? Thanks for having me.

**Kara Swisher** (1:21)
Good. Thank you for being here. You've been on a bit of a roll. You've been on a bit of a roll.

**Jennifer Welch** (1:25)
I'm always getting in trouble. I'm always stepping in it.

**Kara Swisher** (1:29)
What's your latest step in it? What have you done?

**Jennifer Welch** (1:31)
Well, they're really mad at me about the homeschooling.
Then recently, a friend sent me a tweet because I said, I think that Melania was purposeful and intentional in her documentary that she wanted everybody to know that she doesn't sleep with Donald Trump. Well, this got clipped up on right-wing media, in the Heartbreak Hotel, in the comment section because I think surely there's nobody left in the cult. It's like, they do too sleep together, they love each other, at least somebody loves him, nobody loves you. They were really defending hardcore. I'm like, she doesn't sleep with him.

**Kara Swisher** (2:06)
Yeah, she doesn't sleep with him. You still believe that people have left the cult. I don't believe that at all. I think they're in it to win it at this point.

**Jennifer Welch** (2:14)
I agree with you. I think they're in it to win it. I do.

**Kara Swisher** (2:19)
What is the reaction when you do things like this, like not today fascists, for example? Explain the name of your upcoming book. It's kind of apparent.

**Jennifer Welch** (2:25)
Okay. Obviously, I grew up in the Bible belt.
In Bible culture, everybody would say, not today Satan. So when I was writing the book and we're coming up with the title, it's when Stephen Miller was like, you can't call us fascists and we're going to make it, fighting words or an act of terrorism to call us fascists. I'm like, oh, I'm going to put that in the title. I'm going to call them exactly what they are. I'm not going to bend the knee. So I wanted that front and center in the title, not today fascists.

**Kara Swisher** (2:57)
That's an excellent name. But we talk about the reaction to you. Is it gotten worse? Because I was talking to Maggie Haberman and she was saying that the hits, again, the hits that Trump doesn't quite hit it as much as they used to.
He just attacked her this week.

**Jennifer Welch** (3:12)
Well, it depends. Right now, Hassan Piker is really captivating the space where a lot of people would be critical of me.
But right-wing media loves to clip me up and go bananas. I recently said, I know what they're really mad at. So I recently said that as a woman who grew up in the Bible Belt, Sharia law or radical Islam is not a threat. Radical Christianity, fundamentalist Christianity is a far bigger threat to women, a far bigger threat to children, a far bigger threat in the United States of America. And they have gone bananas. And they don't get it. They don't understand that from my vantage point, the Republican politicians in the state of Oklahoma are about taking rights away. Fast forward, I moved to New York City.
Muslim mayor here is about giving more rights to people, not leaving anybody behind. But they're really mad about that because I go after the religious right pretty hard. And that really riles them up.

**Kara Swisher** (4:13)
And do you go back a lot? What happens when you go back? Because there must be people there who agree with you.