Trump restores gun rights for the mentally ill (seriously)

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**Rachel Maddow** (0:48)
Good evening, Chris. Thank you very much, my friend. I actually, if you don't mind, if you do not have to rush off, can I just, can I interview you a little bit about the Graham Plattner news? I wanted to know, I mean, I saw your coverage of it over the course of this last hour, but what do you think is going to happen?

**Chris Hayes** (1:07)
It seems untenable for me that he will continue, although I'm, you know, ultimately we should note that the way this works is that it is his decision. He won the, he won the nomination. So no one can force him out. Obviously, all the signals are being sent from I think anyone that has any influence that they want him to drop out. I think that's a combination of a political calculation, probably first and foremost, that he is too damaged politically to beat Susan Collins or be the best candidate. And I think also a moral calculation that the allegation here is the most serious allegation of everything that has been said about him.
And I think because of the way that the individual making the allegation presented it, how manifestly obviously tortured she was, cross pressured about politics, that that is also having a resonance with people. But again, he did win the primary, and a lot of people didn't run in that race because they thought it was going to be really hard to beat Susan Collins, and they ran the gubernatorial race, which is the context for all of this of why in some ways it has gotten to this point.

**Rachel Maddow** (2:11)
Yeah, and I was just, I mean, as soon as I read the news today, I mean, there was this sort of rumblings as he had canceled a bunch of events, including Independence Day events, and his campaign schedule kind of blew up, so kind of felt like something was coming. And then as soon as the Politico piece came out, I just immediately was thinking about your seminal interview with him after the last round of very serious allegations against him, which he denied like he denies these. And I mean, having that conversation with him in that incredibly intense moment right around the primary, what was your, I guess, what was your take on like, is this the kind of guy that no matter what is said about him, no matter how big the bomb is that goes off, he is committed to never apologizing and never getting out?
Or did you feel like it matters on what the revelation is?

**Chris Hayes** (3:07)
I think I came away with the latter. I also didn't feel we played this in my show, but there was a few different ways I asked, a few different ways of, is there anything else out there?

**Rachel Maddow** (3:18)
Yes.

**Chris Hayes** (3:19)
And I'll just say that I didn't, he basically said no, but I didn't necessarily feel like that no was 100% convincing. Again, this is being just like reading body language and making a personal judgment. It's not because I didn't say no, it's just the way that you react.
That no felt like a little wobbly, I'll just say it. I think other people who heard the no felt like a little wobbly too and I think that's obviously borne out.

**Rachel Maddow** (3:52)
Yeah. I will tell you just a little.
When you did that interview, I listened to it live on SiriusXM as it was happening. On that point, which you were very insistent with him on, I was like, that doesn't sound like a categorical clear, no, and I went home and watched the tape version of you do because I wanted to see him give his answer too, and that was my take too. Again, reading body language and reading somebody's personal affect on things like that, is the world's most unscientific assessment, but I think you and I had the same, I at least had the same inkling that you did there.