Taylor and Andrew Debate Cost Controls (We Ran the Numbers)

**SPEAKER_1** (0:00)
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**Andrew Faris** (1:27)
You want to start there or do you want to yell at me?

**Taylor** (1:30)
No, no, no. We could start with that because I think-

**SPEAKER_1** (1:33)
We can start with what?

**Taylor** (1:34)
Yell at me or date? Research because I think this is a good one for the two of us. That's why I even think it's a good place for us to, we have been waiting to publish this, but I think you've probably, I'd say, taken over as the cost cap maxi lord.
I think so.

**Andrew Faris** (1:53)
I think so.

**Taylor** (1:54)
I think I've backed off of it so much because I just hate the argument so much now.

**Andrew Faris** (1:58)
I'm getting there.

**Taylor** (1:59)
You've picked up the flag and I think.

**Andrew Faris** (2:00)
The reason why is that I'm so close to accounts that I see, it just still makes me so crazy to look at somebody's business and look at the dollars being lit on fire. It just breaks me. I don't actually care about what is the best media buying method. That's not what I care about. What I care about is how to grow your business without lighting money on fire.
I think it's just a big thing. The actual position I hate the most is this doesn't matter. Unless there's a data-driven reason to say it doesn't matter. Then it's fine.
But this doesn't matter. Go make more creative is just like, I don't understand why we can't care about both. Anyway, you're right. I do think I've become that to some degree.

**Taylor** (2:41)
I'd be curious, what do you think the industry disposition is now? I feel like the Overton window moved a lot.
Most people conceded eventually to the idea that this is it.

**Andrew Faris** (2:53)
Manual bids?

**Taylor** (2:53)
Yeah.

**Andrew Faris** (2:55)
I actually don't know if I think that. I still see some pretty loud voices. I think the auto bidders stopped arguing about it at some point.

**Taylor** (3:03)
Okay.
Well, so what I want to say is that one of the things I try to do, despite maybe my more dogmatic public presentation, is that I just really want the idea to work. I don't actually care about the merits of the idea. I don't want to run people's ad accounts if it's a bad strategy to do that, right?

**Andrew Faris** (3:21)
Exactly.

**Taylor** (3:23)
So the way we got to this was not to begin with dogma, it was to begin with what would be the best way to protect their money.

**Andrew Faris** (3:30)
That's exactly my point, is that that's the reason I care about it too, is like, yeah.

**Taylor** (3:36)
So with that, I think that one of the experiences, one of the things we've been struggling with, because we've been working really hard to try and, we call it the canon, like, operationalize a defined set of ideology further than we've ever gone before.

**Andrew Faris** (3:48)
Yeah.

**Taylor** (3:48)
And you get into really hard questions about setting bids.