RERUN: Xapo's Wences Casares on How Bitcoin Makes a Fairer World

**Laura Shin** (0:00)
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Hi, everyone, Laura here. For those of you who celebrate Christmas, Merry Christmas.
I'm taking some time off, but thought I'd release a rerun of my interview with Wences Casares, the CEO of Xapo. This is one of my most popular episodes, and Wences has a compelling personal backstory that explains how he was able to grasp the potential of Bitcoin so early. It's also the first interview I did post Forbes. So it launched the era of the weekly episodes, which makes it personally meaningful to me as well.
Next week is the 100th episode of Unchained. You guys have sent in absolutely amazing submissions for it. I'm really touched. It's so fun listening to the diversity of voices we have from both past guests and listeners. When I look back and see what has come of this little podcast I started as a side project in 2016, I'm blown away. I'll talk more about that journey next week. But in the meantime, enjoy this Unchained with Wences and have a wonderful holiday. Hi, everyone. Welcome to Unchained, the podcast where we hear from innovators, pioneers and thought leaders in the world of blockchain and cryptocurrency. I'm your host, Laura Shin, an independent journalist covering all things crypto.
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**Laura Shin** (2:47)
Before we get started today, I have three big announcements. First, you may have noticed I did not say I was a senior editor at Forbes. I've decided to step down to focus on what is my second big announcement. The fact that I'm taking Unchained weekly. This was my number one most requested quote unquote improvement to the show. And I'm excited to finally be able to meet that demand. The third announcement is that I'm launching a new podcast. It will feature the same marquee names and crypto, but in a new format and with a different focus. The first episode drops soon. I'll post a reminder here in the Unchained feed so you can go check it out and subscribe. If you or your company is interested in sponsoring either show, please send an email to laurashinpodcast.
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Today's guest is Wences Casares, CEO of Bitcoin Vault and wallet company Xapo. Welcome Wences.

**Wences Casares** (3:46)
Thank you, Laura, for having me in the show.

**Laura Shin** (3:50)
You're a serial entrepreneur who founded Argentina's first internet service provider and Latin America's first online brokerage firm.
And you serve on the board of PayPal, which isn't a small company. And yet you've often said you think Bitcoin will be bigger than the internet. Why?

**Wences Casares** (4:05)
Well, I can imagine a world in which if Bitcoin succeeds for a few billion people, if you ask them whether they prefer that you take away their internet, which is access to information or their Bitcoin, which is access to their money, that they rather have you take away their internet, but not their Bitcoin.

**Laura Shin** (4:28)
And I've also heard you say that you believe the unbanked are, what number is that?

**Wences Casares** (4:36)
There's a billion to 1.2 billion people who have a checking account and a debit card or a credit card the way you and I understand those products. Everybody else has much, much more restricted access to very basic banking services.