Radioactive Russian Drones - A Conversation with Vitaly Shevchenko

Natia Seskuria (0:06)

Hello and welcome to RUSI in London. I'm Natia Seskuria, Senior Research Fellow for Russia, Eurasia and Black Sea Security at RUSI. And this is Global Security Briefing, the podcast from RUSI's International Security Team that provides insights on security developments around the world.

In April this year, Ukrainian air defenses shot down modified Russian Geran-2 strike drone over Chenehiv region near the village of Khanka. Investigators examining the wreckage found a radiation warning label on the warhead and detected gamma radiation at levels many times above the natural background. The story traveled quickly. Within hours, it was being reported internationally as Russia using radioactive weapons and in some accounts as a dirty bomb.

The Security Service of Ukraine says the drone was carrying an R-60, a small Soviet air-to-air missile first fielded in 1970 The R-60M variant in service since 1982 uses a fragmentation element made of depleted uranium weighing around 2.8 kilograms. Russia has been mounting these missiles on Geran-2 drones to threaten the Ukrainian aircraft and helicopters sent up to intercept them. The SBU has since documented further cases, two strikes in Sumy region in April and six more across Chernihiv region between April and June. Tests of debris found gamma radiation levels far above the permitted limit. A war crimes investigation has been opened under Article 438 of Ukraine's Criminal Code. This is therefore a story about a weapon, but also about evidence, who produces it, how it is verified and how it is reported in the hours before anyone can check it. To take us through it, I'm joined by the author of a recent BBC Monitoring explainer on this, Vitaly Shevchenko, Russia editor at BBC Monitoring, which is a specialist service within the BBC World Service, delivering trusted analysis of open-source media around the world. Vitaly has spent more than a decade reading Russian and Ukrainian media for a living. The four questions we'll work through today are, What did Ukrainian investigators find? And what does the modification of these drones tell us about how Russia is adapting its strike campaign? How are the claims of this kind verified? And how is radiation being used by both sides as an instrument of information warfare?

What social and cultural significance does this story carry in Ukraine and in Russia? And finally, what does this episode tell us about the value of media monitoring in an environment of information overload and deliberate disinformation?

Vitaly, many thanks for joining Global Security Briefing. I would like to begin by asking you to take our audience through the investigation you worked on and explain why its findings matter. In April, Ukrainian investigators examining missile wreckage in Chernihiv region reportedly found evidence suggesting that the weapon may have contained radioactive material. Could you describe what they recovered at the site and what has since been established about the missile and its warhead?

Vitaly Shevchenko (3:16)

The Ukrainian Security Service, the SBU, they said they found radioactive wreckage of Russian drones and also radioactive missiles. The word nuclear, they didn't use.

The first question in my mind was how on earth they found out this kind of debris was radioactive because they don't normally walk about with a meter checking things for radioactivity. Now, that is simple enough because these missiles, parts of these missiles had radioactive warning signs on them. That prompted the Ukrainians to check them for radioactivity, and they found out that the levels they registered were about 80, eight zero times higher than natural radiation.

There's a number of social media posts by the Ukrainian Security Service showing what they actually found. It was basically bits of twisted metal, bits of missiles, bits of drones, kind of shallow craters in what appear to be unpopulated areas. And the tone and the wording of these social media posts was slightly alarming, I would say. They kept saying, well, look, this is dangerous, do not approach it. There were pictures of people wearing hazmat suits. So if you were not a specialist in these things, the message you were likely to get is, oh my God, this is kind of nuclear warfare. The Russians are sending nuclear drones to Ukraine. Stay away from them.

Natia Seskuria (5:17)

Russia appears to be mounting a Soviet era air-to-air missile and strike drone in order to threaten the aircraft and helicopters intercepting them. What does that adaptation tell us about the state of Russian production and stockpiles?

Vitaly Shevchenko (5:32)

Soon enough, various online experts and real-life experts in Ukraine as well, they found out what sort of weapon was attached to these Russian drones. Now, the drones themselves, they are Ubiquitous Shahed or Geran drones, as they're known in Russia. It's this modification that was new, the modification that allowed these missiles to be attached to the drones. The missiles aren't new at all. They are R60 missiles which are half a century old. That technology is half a century old. They were first developed by the Soviet Union in the 1970s. Later, a modification appeared which allowed radioactive rods to be used in them. Now, one of the first questions I had in my mind, why would anyone use radioactive rods in missiles?