Pivot Extra: Inside “Musk”: Power, Family and the Making of a Tech Demagogue

Kara Swisher (0:00)

It's Sunday, and that means you get a special edition of other podcasts from the Kara and Scott universe. This week, we've got an episode of On with Kara Swisher. Hope you enjoy it, and we'll see you again on Tuesday.

Hi everyone, from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network, this is On with Kara Swisher and I'm Kara Swisher.

The story of how Elon Musk went from an average tech entrepreneur to the richest man in the world has been told many times over the years, including by yours truly.

But even I sometimes struggle to really comprehend it all. How did this man with a reputation for failing to deliver on so many big promises become the world's first trillionaire? How do you become such a dominant force in so many vital industries, tech, yes, but also automobile, space, and communications, and now politics too? And why do we let him amass so much power and influence? And what does it all add up to? And also, why does he want so many kids? Filmmaker Alex Gibney wanted to answer some of those questions. His new documentary, Musk, tries to connect the dots between Musk's many companies to tell a bigger story about the unique threat he poses to democracy. Of course, I'm in the film, and so is Musk's first wife, Justine. She's speaking out for the first time in years. Both are here with me to talk today about the film, which clocks in at four hours. There's an intermission. Gibney is also no stranger to difficult subjects. His past films have covered Scientology, Enron, Elizabeth Holmes, WikiLeaks, and the US Policy on Torture during the war in Afghanistan. He's won Emmys and an Oscar, but the media environment is a lot different today because of how much power people like Musk have over the way information gets shared. Gibney is facing a lot of headwinds to get this film out. I think this is a really terrific film. It is very long, but he manages to knit it together and it is worth the time you spend on it because this is the singular most important figure in politics, in business, and in our society today. It's really revealing to put it all together, and especially for those who don't know the story. And I think Gibney has been very fair to him. Musk says it's a hit piece. It is not. It's really important. All right. Let's get into this conversation with Alex Gibney and Justine Musk. Our expert question comes from Kirsten Grine from the New York Times who's covered Musk an awful lot and done some astonishing stories. This is one I promise you're not going to want to miss, so stick around.

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Kara Swisher (4:18)

Alex and Justine, thank you for coming on On. I really appreciate it.

Alex Gibney (4:22)

Great to be here.

Justine Musk (4:23)

Thank you for having me.

Kara Swisher (4:24)

First of all, amazing movie, an astonishing documentary, very long, obviously. And I will say, Justine, I find you to be at the center of it. I thought what you were saying was really important for people to understand, especially in the context of this very long story.

Justine Musk (4:40)

Thank you. I appreciate that.

Kara Swisher (4:42)

So let's begin. Alex, you started work on this film in 2022, a little after Elon Musk first became the richest man in the world before he got involved with Trump.