Paul Krugman on UFOs, AI and Room Temperature Superconductors

Tracy Alloway (0:00)

Hello, Odd Lots listeners. We recorded an episode with our friends over at What Goes Up. It's live today, so go check it out. It's called the Odd Lots Crossover episode.

Joe Weisenthal (0:10)

Yep, we chatted with the hosts, Mike Regan and Vildana Hyruk, about a bunch of topics that are near and dear to Odd Lots listeners, ranging from the growing power of organized labor, the trillion dollar coin, EVs, Bidenomics and more.

Tracy Alloway (0:24)

You can find it on the What Goes Up podcast, available on Spotify, Apple or anywhere else that you get your podcast fix.

Joe Weisenthal (0:42)

Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Odd Lots Podcast. I'm Joe Weisenthal.

Tracy Alloway (0:46)

And I'm Tracy Alloway.

Joe Weisenthal (0:48)

Tracy, it feels like there are many things in the news these days that are like on the edge of reality and frankly, science fiction.

Tracy Alloway (0:56)

More evidence that we're living in the simulation.

No, you're absolutely right. So first of all, we had this influx of AI technology. Everyone got very into ChatGPT, and now everyone's talking about future AI applications.

And then we had, let's see, ooh, we have the excitement over the possibility of a room temperature superconductor. And then even weirder, we have a lot of talk about aliens. We had the congressional hearings about UFOs recently. I actually saw someone tie all of these things together recently. They thought that the LK-99 coming out, like the week after the congressional hearings or the week of was evidence that there are in fact aliens and the technology has come from them. So take that with a grain of salt.

Joe Weisenthal (1:46)

Like the aliens left this little trail of peace for us. Oh, that's interesting.

Tracy Alloway (1:49)

Well, I think one of the conspiracy theories is the reason it feels like all of this is popping up now and sort of going into hyper drive is because the, I don't know, the powers that be are laying the groundwork for us to actually find out there are aliens. So they're sort of dripping it out.

And now the pace is picking up and so it's coming, Joe.

Joe Weisenthal (2:12)

So here's the thing. I do not believe in, I'm like a deep UFO skeptic to the point where I've almost like tuned out all the news.

If we do have a room temperature superconductor, I don't even know what that means. Like I see all these people like, oh my God, we are so back. This is gonna change the world. I still don't really understand the significance.

AI, I think it's pretty cool, but I don't know what it's gonna do yet in terms of the economy. So when you're faced with all these sci-fi things, Tracy, like what kind of guest do you think? Who comes to mind as someone who would talk about this?

Tracy Alloway (2:43)

Who's the first person I call?

Joe Weisenthal (2:44)

Yeah.

Tracy Alloway (2:45)

Well, I guess we have the perfect guest.

Joe Weisenthal (2:49)

We have the perfect guest. We are going to be speaking with Paul Krugman, opinion writer for the New York Times, professor at City University of New York, of course a Nobel Prize winner in economics. And I read on the internet that he was inspired to be an economist because of science fiction.

At least according to a website I'm reading. And so I think to understand the economics, the implications, the thoughts around aliens, AI, superconductors, what they mean for the world and the economy, obviously the first name we call is Paul's. I think this is your first time on our podcast. So Paul, thank you so much for coming on Odd Lots.

Paul Krugman (3:22)

Oh, thanks. I think it is my first time.

Tracy Alloway (3:24)

I'm so proud that the first time you're coming on Odd Lots is to talk about aliens. I'm so happy.

Paul Krugman (3:30)

I know, of all the various things we could be talking about, but hey, I'm pretty bored with inflation.

Joe Weisenthal (3:36)

Yeah, I've got inflation, the Fed, soft landing, fiscal policy, the $600 checks, this recovery versus the other one. It's so boring. It's so tired. Paul, do you think there could be life elsewhere in the galaxy?

Paul Krugman (3:50)

I would think that it's extremely unlikely that there isn't. I mean, there is an argument that says that particularly that complex life may require some very, very special circumstances and we might actually be alone out here, but I guess that sounds unlikely. It doesn't seem like that it should be that hard for there to be someplace else where complex life has arisen. But here's an argument that I don't see very often, which is that if there is other intelligent life out there, just given the time scale of things, it must have evolved hundreds of millions of years before we did.