Murdoch's Succession Battle and the Fight for Fox News

Alastair Campbell (0:00)

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Hi there, welcome to The Rest Is Politics. It's Alastair here, and this week is the finale of our series on Rupert Murdoch. Today, it's all about succession. It's not just squabbling children, we're looking at the politics behind this squabble, the disagreements over the way he backed Donald Trump, and what it all means for Rupert Murdoch's legacy. That sounds interesting. Here is a clip from that episode. We left the last episode with Murdoch regretting in a way, his help via Fox News and Donald Trump's rise to power. And in particular, regretting them buying into the Trump conspiracy theory of the stolen election, which ended up in a court case, which cost Murdoch almost a billion dollars.

Michael Wolff (1:02)

I think it's larger than just regret too. I think it's kind of moving into the territory of a bitter ending for him. His dream was always to elect a president of the United States.

And the bitter irony is that that turned out to be Donald Trump, a man he detests, who he believes is unfit and unworthy, or in brief, as he says, an asshole.

Alastair Campbell (1:33)

And whose children have similar views about Trump, and who are now, because Rupert Murdoch is, as you say, getting towards his final chapters, he's now 94, they really are now beginning to think about succession. But let's just get back to that post-election period. Because as you say, Murdoch despises Trump. He goes around, he calls him crazy. Jerry Hall, his new wife keeps shouting at him and saying, well, you know, you helped put him in president, so do something about it. He's kind of thinking, how can I redeem myself here? And he has this unbelievable idea, perhaps born of something that we referred to in an earlier episode, when he miraculously turned Ed Koch into a charismatic figure, and he went on to become New York mayor. And now Murdoch decides to put his weight behind one Ron DeSantis.

Michael Wolff (2:29)

Certainly in hindsight, it's unbelievable. I mean, the least ready for prime time candidate there could be. I mean, a completely uncharismatic candidate to run against, arguably, the most charismatic. I use the word in the mega sense of charisma. But the idea that Ron DeSantis, the governor of Florida, could run against Donald Trump is certainly in hindsight absolutely ridiculous. But Murdoch goes all in. I mean, his declared policy, Fox is going to not only support Ron DeSantis on the air, but keep Donald Trump off the air. And it is going to be the test, the ultimate test. Who's stronger, Fox or Trump? And we now know.

Alastair Campbell (3:20)

Trump won. When he's doing this stuff about, so like we used to have Roger Ailes kind of sending out these morning memos, you know, hit this point, Obama is this today, this is the line to say. And I remember once watching this thing where one of the media monitoring organizations put together a thing where Roger Ailes had given them a phrase to use on that particular day. And you then saw every single network anchor and every single two-way as the day went on. It came out of their mouth at some point. Murdoch is kind of trying to do something similar here. But he's getting pushback.

Michael Wolff (3:53)

Well, he is because remember, to survive at Fox, you need ratings. And I'm going to tell you Ron DeSantis ain't going to give you ratings compared to Donald Trump. Although that's the policy. I mean, they really, really, really keep Trump off the air. So it's a problem for everyone. And then when DeSantis is wiped out, which is relatively early in the 2024 process, Trump starts to creep back in. And by certainly by the summer 2024 is back as the Fox guy, Murdoch effectively gives up.

Alastair Campbell (4:33)

The two big, big stars of Fox, Hannity and Tucker Carlson, what was the consequence for them of the Dominion Voting Systems Court case in which we ended the last episode?

Michael Wolff (4:45)

Well, curiously, Hannity, who was really guilty here, I mean, he's the one who pressed this Dominion conspiracy business. There are no consequences, quite the opposite.

He continues to rise. But Tucker Carlson is actually as a side agreement in the Dominion case. The Dominion case wants the money, but they also want some pound of flesh. The pound of flesh that they agree with on the side is that Tucker Carlson will be fired. Another irony that Carlson was probably the least implicated in the Dominion conspiracy-mongering stuff. But on the other hand, he's the most prominent MAGA person on the network.