Gov. Braun Remembers Sen. Graham

**SPEAKER_1** (0:00)
Joining us now on the hotline is the governor of the state of Indiana, Governor Mike Braun.
Governor, before you were leading the state as the governor, you were Senator Mike Braun. Tell me about your encounters with Senator Lindsey Graham.

**Mike Braun** (0:17)
So, probably next to Senator Rick Scott from Florida and Ron Johnson from Wisconsin, two business guys.
And maybe guys like Rand Paul, Mike Lee, Ted Cruz. We were all part of that kind of conservative group. Everybody bumped into Lindsey Graham. And I just remember that he was probably the most involved individual in media from the time I met him. Still is. I think he's been on meet the press more than anybody, including Republicans and Democrats.
And he was one that you can see would go from one opinion, maybe to another on the political side and had his own dance with the president, and ran against him in 2016, and then became best buds. And I got to know him pretty well because of things we get entangled with, like on reconciliation. And I was always one trying to get through those quickly, making sure that maybe the older senators weren't passing out in their seats, boating all night, then moving on. And Lindsey was interested in that as well. And then probably midway through my term, got to know him maybe outside of the Senate a little bit, and had a few meals with him. And Richard Burr was a senator from North Carolina, and learned more about the individual. But he was definitely the biggest defense hawk in the Republican caucus. And of course, I'm one that thinks that defense is the most important thing, but we waste as much money there as we do in the rest of the government. So we would have never been eye to eye on it. But defense is the one thing the Constitution says that we should do. And we've gotten into so many other things. And he was never wavering from peace through strength, and making sure you had the proper alliances across the world. And I agree with Trump 100 percent, Europeans and others that have freeloaded need to pay their way. I never heard Lindsey talk too much about that.
But yet, he was able to forge that relationship with the president, where they were both interested in national security. And like I say, I got involved with him, and he was on, I think, chairing the Budget Committee. I was on it all six years. And at least we talked about ways to reign the budget in, where the other side of the aisle never talked one thing about improving the budget, just how to spend more. So he was an interesting guy. He was definitely dynamic. And he always got out there, and what he believed in, he said it, I think, with clarity, and agreed with him on some stuff, and others I didn't, but I respected him for his, kind of where he'd make a point of view, do it articulately, and do it loudly when necessary.

**SPEAKER_1** (3:36)
Governor, we've said that throughout the show. There were things that we agreed with, there were things we disagreed with.
But Lindsey was passionate, one way or the other, he was passionate about what he was doing. I've also heard people tell us that he was a pretty funny guy. Like did you find Lindsey Graham to be a funny, entertaining guy?

**Mike Braun** (3:57)
Well, the first time I had laughed more than I ate that evening is when he called me when we were on one of those Votoramas. So you were trapped in DC. The Lindsey calls me.
I don't think other than just casual discussions and so forth. He invites me to dinner that evening, saying, hey, I'm paying. Well, I'm a smart hoosier. I'm going to go over there and eat a good meal.

**SPEAKER_1** (4:25)
Right, right.

**Mike Braun** (4:26)
With Lindsey paying for it. And I think there was probably some red wine that evening. And Richard Burr was there, too. And then I found out they were wanting to talk to me about taking some of these trips. They're called CODELs, Congressional Delegations. Those are the trips that Lindsey took a lot of them.
But Lindsey generally would do it. I think he was in Ukraine nine times. He was doing it visiting the troops. But there were some funny stories. Whenever you're going on a CODEL, then I'm not going to repeat on the air here because it's part of a private conversation.
But I remember, I laughed so darn hard that evening. And would view that as where you're kind of not in the chamber, not in a committee hearing, just with two other senators that I probably enjoyed as much as any evening in the Senate. And it would have been that humor.