Dutch Prime Minister Rob Jetten Talks Perfect Fit at ECB

SPEAKER_1 (0:02)

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David Gura (0:07)

The Prime Minister of the Netherlands, Rob Jetten, is with me here in New York. Great to have you with us. Let me start with AI, and we heard from President Trump this morning commenting on the apparatus of regulation surrounding AI, and he said he wants to leave it exactly where it is. How do you think about this balance between protecting humanity at one extreme end and then encouraging kind of technological and business development of AI?

Rob Jetten (0:27)

Well, obviously, this technological development and AI can be of huge benefit for humanity, improving healthcare, speeding up or action against climate change, and lots of other issues that can be tackled with this super intelligence as he likes to say. But we have to regulate it because otherwise, it will be some states and some big tech companies that are going to run this world while they don't even fully understand how to control it. That could also create a big danger for the United States and China, too. So we're very much in favor of better regulation on an international level, and that's why the Netherlands, together with some other countries, took the initiative also here during this meeting to sit down and to discuss how we can organize a democratic agency over AI.

David Gura (1:14)

A sobering chapter in this story. This morning, Australia learned that many months ago, an open AI agent was able to hack into a government website. So there's that. That's astonishing. And then there's the delay. Took them a long time to find out that it happened.

What does that say to you? How does that heighten your concern, if at all, knowing that that's happened?

Rob Jetten (1:30)

Well, the big issue, I think, for governments around the world is how to catch up in the speed of technological development, because the democratic process, to have a proper public debate, to come up with legislation or whatsoever, you will never be able to catch up with those developments. So we have to set a framework of regulation that monitors the system, not the content of everything that AI creates.

And we have to do so in a very high speed, because otherwise we will be too late. And the example of Australia shows us that, I think a lot of these tech companies don't even know for themselves what their systems are able to do. So in the end, it's also in the interest of the American president and the Chinese president to be part of this international conversation on regulation, because otherwise it can also hit them hard.

David Gura (2:17)

The Netherlands is home to ASML, of course, a huge company in this sphere. There was a warning from the executive of that company this week that Europe isn't doing enough to help a company like it thrive. Are there structural issues that you see within the Netherlands, within Europe, that are keeping a company like ASML from living up to its fullest potential?

Rob Jetten (2:35)

Well, ASML is a crucial company for the Dutch economy and also for the European autonomy. So we work very closely with them. We've actually laid the grounds two weeks ago for a new plant in the Eindhoven region, where 20,000 people will work on the highest technology of machines by ASML. But it is true that European companies face a lot of issues with access to capital, the speed of R&D, and access also to skilled labor. So we've come up with a special task force to boost the competitiveness of the Dutch economy. We're working closely with UK, France and others to invest heavily also in new technologies and AI on European soil.

But it is been going too slow over the past decade. So we really have to catch up as European governments.

David Gura (3:25)

In Washington, there's a debate over something called the Match Act that would place restrictions on a company like ASML in terms of doing business in China, selling its wares to China. While you're here in the States, are you trying to convey a message to American policymakers and politicians that that might be disadvantageous for a company like ASML?

Rob Jetten (3:41)

Yeah, I already had many conversations with the American president and American lawmakers on the Match Act and the importance to protect the Semicon industry in the Netherlands. That is in our interest, in the American interest, but also in a broader interest. And we have the strictest control, export controls anywhere in the world on ASML to prevent the theft of this highest technology, to prevent Chinese of overtaking the Semicon industry. But we do so in a balanced manner. We're very much open to discuss any improvement of this export control legislation. We have very close cooperation with the American government and also with Japan and South Korea, and we will do so also in the nearby future.