Dude Process, Not Due Process

**Leah Litman** (0:00)
Strict Scrutiny is brought to you by Americans United for Separation of Church and State. It's everywhere right now, the celebration of America's 250th, and we are in the thick of it this month. Christian nationalists are using this milestone not to unite, but to divide. They're pushing the lie that America was founded to be a Christian nation, where just one religious movement gets to decide who fully belongs, instead of the truth that America was founded as a democracy committed to liberty and justice for all. That's propaganda, not patriotism. It's a dangerous lie meant to justify censorship, discrimination, attacks on public schools, assaults on LGBTQ plus rights, restrictions on reproductive freedom, and government favoritism toward one extremist version of Christianity. Americans United for Separation of Church and State is here to fight back against this dangerous and egregious misinterpretation of our founding documents. AU fights daily for everyone's ability to live as themselves and believe as they choose, so long as they don't harm others. Novel idea in the day and age when almost every day we're seeing Christian nationalism weaponize a faith to attack individual freedoms across the country.
Do something patriotic this summer. As you're dodging the propaganda flying at you from all angles, become a member of Americans United. By supporting AU, you're committing to stand up and protect church-state separation in every area of life. Learn more about how you can support and how AU protects everyone's rights at au.org/crooked.

**SPEAKER_2** (1:24)
Mr. Chief Justice is pleased to report. It's an old joke, but when an argument man argues against two beautiful ladies like this, they're going to have the last word.

**SPEAKER_3** (1:37)
She spoke not elegantly, but with unmistakable clarity.

**SPEAKER_2** (1:42)
She said, I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.

**Leah Litman** (2:07)
Welcome back to Strict Scrutiny, your podcast about the Supreme Court and the legal culture that surrounds it. I'm your sole regular host for today, Leah Litman. We're still on summer break and summer schedule, hot Strict Scrutiny summer and all. So while Kate has been holding down the fort for the last two weeks, this week is just me. And joining me today in the guest host chair is Emily Amick. Emily is former Council to Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, but better known to you all as Emily in Your Phone on Instagram and Substack. She's also the co-author of Democracy in Retrograde, a self-help guide to building a better civic life for everyone. Welcome back to Strict Scrutiny, Emily.

**Emily Amick** (2:40)
Hey, Leah. I'm so happy to be here.

**Leah Litman** (2:42)
I am happy you are here as well. We should say we are recording this on kind of a hotspot on Emily's phone, so unclear exactly what is going to happen. But that is the situation, and that's how committed we are to getting this to you.

**Emily Amick** (2:54)
Technology is making life wonderful, but also challenging us at every moment.

**Leah Litman** (3:01)
Indeed. So later in the episode, you'll hear a conversation I had with Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, Commissioner, the sole remaining Democratic appointed EEOC Commissioner, Kalpana Kotagal, about the fallout from the court's decision in Trump versus Slaughter and the demise of agency independence, focused specifically on the EEOC as a formerly independent agency. But before that, Emily and I are going to chat legal news, and we're going to cover a lot of immigration related developments in the courts and the executive branch, and I think the basic themes of the episode are going to be dude process, instead of due process, and why are men's? And I should just say, bring on the e-mails telling me I am too mean to men, I can take it, I just got back from vacation, I am happy.

**Emily Amick** (3:45)
Don't send me those e-mails because I already know.

**Leah Litman** (3:47)
Just me, I already know, and I hear this all the time.

**Emily Amick** (3:53)
You know, men, I think they should just stop doing bad things and then we won't be mean to them anymore. This is my theory.

**Leah Litman** (3:58)
That sounds like a plan, I'm on board with that.
But if you're thinking, I listen to these episodes all the time, what am I getting out of them? Well, do I have news for you? If you're a lawyer looking for fun new ways to get your CLE credits, listening to Strict Scrutiny is now one way to do it. We just launched our first course, it's our Scotus Term Recap episode that came out the first week of July, and right now it's approved for California, New York and Pennsylvania. And we'll keep you updated as more states are added. This is something new we're trying, so if enough people sign up, we'll hopefully add more episodes in the future. Go to crooked.com/strictunderscorecle to learn more and buy the course. Once you've purchased, you'll head over to our partners at Lawline, an accredited CLE provider responsible for CLE administration, to access it for course credit. Happy continuing educationing to all.