"Death, Sex, and Money": Talking Smart About Hard Things With Anna Sale

**Morra Aarons-Mele** (0:00)
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A lot of the conversations I have in my own life and the conversations I have on the show aren't easy, because talking about mental health involves diving into a whole lot of stigma, guilt, shame, frustration, vulnerability, it comes from the person experiencing the issue and those around them, whether they're family, friends, or colleagues. Well, today's guest is someone who loves these kinds of conversations, and I was excited to grill her a bit as well, to learn about her sources of shame, vulnerability, and taboo. Anna Sale is the host of the podcast, Death, Sex & Money, a role she's had for years after being a political reporter in public radio.
Throughout the life of the show, she's also had children, moved across the country, gone through many ups and downs, and written a recent book. Here's my conversation with the wonderful Anna Sale about life, work, and taboo.
The first thing I just wanted to ask is, have you always liked talking about things that other people don't? Where does this come from?

**Anna Sale** (3:12)
You know, people have asked me that and I'm like, it's made me feel like I'm an alien. I'm like, huh, am I like, how out of the ordinary am I? I don't think of my personality as one that's particularly drawn to tough things or hard things. But what I do really get fed by is that feeling when you really lock into a conversation with someone.

**Morra Aarons-Mele** (3:34)
Yeah.

**Anna Sale** (3:35)
So, you know, I think that often when that's happening, it's because between you and another person, something is being shared that is a little out of the ordinary, that's a little bit more deep. And yeah, I love that. That is like what I live for.

**Morra Aarons-Mele** (3:54)
Yeah. I only ask not to, I didn't want to make you feel defensive. I think it's amazing. I am the same way and I don't really do small talk. I'm extremely introverted and extremely socially anxious. But I do find that people end up telling me things that they don't tell other people, because I just, I used to think it was because I was on the internet for so many years and I was a blogger, but like, I don't have filters that other people do, in a way. Like I'll just ask people things, because I really want to know and I want to connect and I love hearing people's stories.
And I listen to your show and I think, oh my gosh, I wonder what Anna is like at a cocktail party.

**Anna Sale** (4:36)
I'm like the same way.
Are you? I'm like in the corner with someone who I've like had an interesting exchange with and then we just keep digging in together.

**Morra Aarons-Mele** (4:46)
Have you ever gotten the feedback?
So I did get the feedback once that it was a lot. Someone was like, you know, sometimes it's just a lot, okay? Like sometimes we just want to talk about like reality TV. And I was like, okay, okay, I get that.