Adam Kinzinger: Trump Is a Cheese-Eating Surrender Monkey

**Tim Miller** (0:40)
Hello, and welcome to The Bulwark Podcast. I'm your host, Tim Miller. Delighted to welcome back to the show, a former member of Congress from Illinois. He served in the Air Force and Air National Guard. He's got a new podcast, The Kinzinger Report. He's on Substack.
It's Adam Kinzinger.

**Adam Kinzinger** (0:56)
Hey, buddy. What's up?

**Tim Miller** (0:57)
If we're going to have a surrender, if we're going to celebrate Donald Trump, the cheese eating surrender monkey, signing away the war that he started in France next to Emmanuel Macron, I can't think about anybody better to have to discuss it than you. So thank you for joining.

**Adam Kinzinger** (1:13)
Yeah, thanks, man. Thanks. When my brother and I used to play, those green army men and then you had the gray army men, we used to play that game and of course, my brother's five years older, so we'd always win and I remember once I was a kid.
Of course, I was a kid, I'm playing green army men, but I remember I surrendered to him and there was an old church song. It's like, I surrender all, that one, so I started singing that and my brother made fun of me. Anyway, there you go.

**Tim Miller** (1:39)
Okay. Well, obviously, I went with the alt rock suicide song, but sure, Hillsong Worship, I Surrender. We can look at that one too. I was discussing this with JVL yesterday.
We were reading select excerpts of JD Vance's book together and his conversion to Christianity. Excuse me, his conversion to Catholicism. It's hard to tell from the book he wants to be a Catholic. He's trying to be everything. But in the book about his conversion to Catholicism, he talks about how the music is so much better at evangelical churches. He's got to throw some bones to the evangelicals for the primary. He's telling his priest to maybe go check out the local Baptist and evangelical church to hear how they do the music. It's like, bro, you just joined the club. You just joined us two minutes ago. Don't be telling the priest what music to play.

**Adam Kinzinger** (2:30)
You can have a vote on what you guys are having for potluck lunch, but you're not a music yet. I've only been to a few Catholic services as a Protestant, but I can't imagine a drum set up in front of the priest.
Maybe that happens.

**Tim Miller** (2:46)
When I was growing up in the 90s, there was a move as the evangelicals were getting some steam, what they would do at Catholic churches is on Saturday night, there'd be a teen mass.
This is how we're going to appeal to the youth. There'd be a rock band doing Christian rock. I just remember going to those things and being like, this is awful. This is making me less interested.

**Adam Kinzinger** (3:13)
You always had the youth pastor that's like, bro, we're going to bring pizza, we're going to hang, we're going to talk about stuff. It's always some 25-year-old that ends up getting caught up in a scandal.

**Tim Miller** (3:24)
The old Catholic Kinz are the only thing I like about the Sunday morning church. You've taken them away and now you've got this ear poison.

**Adam Kinzinger** (3:30)
By the way, speaking of JD, I saw Jason Kander actually, he was the former Secretary of State, I think in Missouri.
He found JD Vance's tell. JD Vance now, when he's going to go into talking points right before he does it, he says, let me say this or let me just go ahead and say something. He said, every time he says that, there is the administration approved talking point. I tell you, it's too early for JD to be revealing his tells if he wants to run for president.

**Tim Miller** (4:01)
I should check in with Jason Kander, that's a good dude. All right, let's run through the elements of The Surrender, the 14 points in the MOU.
We're going to talk about how it's in Versailles, because it really is, it's really something that we're back in the Treaty of Versailles 2, Electric Boogaloo. But we're going to go through a couple of them, because I think actually reading them is pretty telling, speaking of tells. This is point one of the MOU. The United States of America and the Islamic Republic of Iran and their allies in the current war are signing this MOU to declare the immediate and permanent termination of military operations on all fronts, including in Lebanon. The final deal will confirm the permanent termination of the war on all fronts, including in Lebanon. It goes on. There's three mentions of Lebanon in the first point.