Top 5 of 2025: #1: Howard Marks

**Ted Seides** (0:00)
This week, we continue our countdown of the most popular episodes of 2025 with the top three. And the most popular episode of 2025 is the legend Howard Marks from Oaktree. I waited a while to have Howard on the show to capture a moment where one of his memos particularly caught my eye. That happened when he wrote Gimme Credit earlier this year. We dive into his thoughts on the implications of the growth of private credit for investors. And with that, I hope you sprint to the finish line of the year with all the gusto in your soul and come out on the other side of the ball drop with renewed excitement, aspirations and energy for the year ahead.
Hello, I'm Ted Seides, and this is Capital Allocators. This show is an open exploration of the people and process behind capital allocation. Through conversations with leaders in the money game, we learn how these holders of the keys to the kingdom allocate their time and their capital. You can join our mailing list and access premium content at capitalallocators.com.

**SPEAKER_3** (1:14)
All opinions expressed by Ted and Podcast guests are solely their own opinions and do not reflect the opinion of Capital Allocators or their firms. This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as a basis for investment decisions. Clients of Capital Allocators or Podcast guests may maintain positions and securities discussed on this podcast.

**Ted Seides** (1:33)
My guest on today's show is Howard Marks, a renowned investment thinker and the co-founder and co-chairman of Oaktree Capital Management, a leading global investment firm overseeing $200 billion, primarily in credit investments that's majority owned by Brookfield Asset Management. Our conversation covers Howard's journey from his early days in finance to his current insights on the evolving credit landscape. We dive into themes from his latest memo, Gimme Credit, exploring the pendulum swings in investor sentiment, the rise of private credit and implications for investors. We also discuss the changing dynamics of private equity, the trend of asset manager M&A, and life as a public company. Throughout our conversation, Howard shares his timeless wisdom on risk management, market cycles, and the enduring principles of successful investing. Before we get to the interview, Investor Relations Pros, this one's for you. Registration is open for our next cohort of Capital Allocators University for investor relations and business development professionals, happening in New York City on July 8th and 9th. Even better, we're offering an early bird discount for registrations before Memorial Day. Our first cohort was a total blast. It's rare that capital raisers spend time with each other, discussing best practices and sharing common challenges. This year, we're bringing together a powerhouse line up of industry pros to share their best ideas and help you sharpen your edge. Head to capitalallocators.com/university to learn more and save your spot. Hope to see you in July. Capital Allocators is brought to you by my friends at WCM Investment Management. WCM has the courage to back future histories not evident today. Informed by their unrelenting focus on mode trajectory, and elevated by insights on corporate culture. WCM's deep roots in public markets set the foundation for its approach to private investing. They didn't just want to enter the private markets, they wanted to improve the investing model itself. Build something better aligned, more thoughtful, and truly long term. As a firm owned by its people and grounded in Laguna Beach, WCM is built for alignment and independent thought. Rather than chasing a scoreboard, WCM invests with a partnership mentality to build meaningful relationships with founders reimagining their industries. They show up earlier, stick around later, and let value compound over years. WCM's style is their edge. Authenticity over formality, two-way learnings over checklists, and stories over slide decks. To learn more, visit wcminvest.com.
This testimonial will be provided by Ted Seides and Capital Allocators, who have been compensated a flat fee by WCM. This payment was made in connection with Capital Allocators' testimonial and production of podcasts, and does not depend on the success or level of business generated. The opinions expressed are solely those of Capital Allocators and may not reflect the opinions of others. Investing involves risk, including the possible loss of principle. Past performance is not indicative of future results. Please visit wcminvest.com for WCM's ADV and further information. Capital Allocators is also brought to you by SRS Aquium. Want to make sure your M&A processes aren't stuck in the past? Partner with a company that's been defining the future of deal making for nearly two decades instead. When it comes to M&A innovation, SRS Aquium has reshaped the way that deals get done, streamlining processes for maximum efficiency and minimum headaches. Professional shareholder representation, online M&A payments, digital stockholder solicitation. SRS Aquium pioneered each and continues to set the bar for game-changing innovation. So leave the days of disjointed deal management behind and define your future with SRS Aquium, the smartest way to run a deal. Learn more at srsaquium.com. That's srsacquiom.com.