The Psychology of Authenticity | Seth Godin - From The Vault

Seth Godin (0:00)

I don't think people want authenticity. When you are working with a professional who is having a bad day, you don't want them to be authentic. You want them to be consistent. You want them to be the best version of themselves. Authenticity in 2024 is often used as an excuse for being a jerk.

Michael Gervais (0:15)

Welcome back, or welcome to the Finding Mastery podcast, where we dive into the minds of the world's greatest thinkers and doers. I am your host, Dr. Michael Gervais. Today's episode is From the Finding Mastery Vault, a conversation with Seth Godin, best-selling author, entrepreneur, teacher, and one of the most influential thinkers of our time on leadership, creativity, marketing, and making meaningful change. We first released this conversation a few years ago, and the world just feels noisier and faster, and more consumed by judgment than before.

Seth's ideas feel remarkably relevant today.

Seth Godin (0:52)

I want people to realize what a miracle this moment in time is, and to stop squabbling.

To stop squabbling with each other and to stop squabbling with themselves. I want them to fix problems before they become too big to fix. And I want us to stop being toddlers and start being grown-ups.

Michael Gervais (1:11)

At the heart of this conversation is a deceptively simple question. What is the change you seek to make?

Seth Godin (1:17)

We all quit, and we don't talk about it, and we don't think about it. But the fact is, unless you're wearing a tutu or still playing ice hockey at the age of 40, you quit things your whole life.

And we need to get better at it, and we need to be clear about the difference between quitting a dead end and quitting in the dip.

Michael Gervais (1:37)

With that, let's jump into this week's conversation from The Vault with Seth Godin. Seth, welcome to the Finding Mastery podcast. I am so stoked to sit down with you. But before we jump in, just want to ask and see how you're doing. Like, how are you?

Seth Godin (1:58)

I'm really good. Thank you for asking. And I was told if I came here, I would find some mastery. So bring it on. I'm ready.

Michael Gervais (2:05)

Yeah, that's good.

Seth Godin (2:06)

Okay, good.

Michael Gervais (2:06)

Maybe just before we dive into the mastery piece, let's just start with a bit of a state of the union. You know, you are known as a marketing genius. You've been writing and teaching and speaking about business and creativity for decades. And so with that in mind, we're just kicking off 2024 What is your personal state of the union right now on leadership and teamwork and the way that you're designing your life? Three part question.

Seth Godin (2:31)

Okay, well, so I'm obligated by the FCC to point out that marketing isn't what most people think it is. It's not podcast ads or interrupting people or spamming them or hyping. It's not promotion and getting the word out. That's what marketing used to be. It used to be advertising.

What my work has been about is telling and living true stories that engage with people and spread. Stories that make a change happen that we're proud of. And because I wrote the books, I get to decide what marketing is and that's what I decided it is. So with that said, when we think about any period of time, call it a new year if you want, the ideas of leadership and teamwork, of making a difference, these are marketing choices because every time we open our mouths, every time we type something, talk to someone, connect in any way, we're doing it to make a change happen. If we're not here to make a change, why are we wasting other people's time?

Too often, we get seduced or indoctrinated into thinking that our job is to do our job. I don't think that's really the work. The work is to be clear about who we're here to change, what we're trying to change, and how we're going to do it together. That's been the narrative of my life for a bunch of years and it's not changing right now.

Michael Gervais (3:56)

State of the Union then is consistent. When you think about leadership, how do you think about leadership?

Seth Godin (4:05)

A lot of people are confused by leadership versus management. They think that managers lead and leaders manage. They're totally different activities. Sometimes one person does both, but lots of times not. Leadership is a voluntary activity in which someone decides to speak up, to make a change happen, and to ask for folks to follow them.