The Neuroscience Of How To Improve Your Memory & Focus - Dr Charan Ranganath - #939

**Chris Williamson** (0:00)
Why is memory important?

**Charan Ranganath** (0:03)
Well, memory is probably not important for the reason people think it is, right? So we always think, well, memory is important when we can't remember. Then we get frustrated about it. We say, oh, why can't I remember this person's name? Why can't I remember the name of that guy who is that thing? Why memory is really important is because it's absolutely central to helping us understand the present, where we are at space, when we are at time, and to be able to plan and imagine possible futures. So if you look at people with memory disorders, their problem in life is not that they can't remember the past per se. It's that their inability to remember the past makes it hard for them to remember whether they've eaten recently or they end up repeating themselves over and over again or they just don't have much foresight into what they will do in the future. They have all of these deficits that keep them from living independently. Not because they can't tell you what happened, you know, an hour ago or something. It's because that inability leads them to just not be able to do almost anything that healthy people do in society in a day to day basis.

**Chris Williamson** (1:22)
Yeah. So you've sort of touched on something there. You've got a self that experiences stuff, and you've got a self that remembers you experiencing stuff. What is the relationship, the difference, the tension between these two selves?

**Charan Ranganath** (1:37)
Well, one of the things that we know from memory research is that the overwhelming majority of what we experience will be forgotten, right? So if your listeners end up telling somebody, hey, I heard this great interview on this podcast. The interviewer was on fire, you know, and so then they describe it to one of their friends. If they spend 10 minutes describing this long-form conversation that we're having, that would be a huge success memory-wise, right? There's no way anyone's gonna regurgitate every word of what we said. And many of the important points we talk about, people will probably forget, right? So here's the thing. Now I wanna make a decision about my life. Now I wanna make a decision about whether to take vacation. Well, what do I do? I think about all the past vacations I've taken, where I went and whether I like them or not. And if I do that, I'm gonna be relying not on what I experienced, but on memory, which is much, much more, much less complete, right? It's this tiny fraction of what we actually experience. And so Danny Kahneman, the Nobel Prize-winning psychologist, referred to this idea that we have an experiencing self that lives through all of these things that we do, but the remembering self only has access to a tiny bit of that information. And that's the basis on which we decide, am I happy right now? What do I want to do in the future?
Where am I? And so forth. We're really in the situation where we make most of our decisions based on the remembering self. And it's almost as if they're two different people because of the fact that the experiencing self is in the present and the remembering self is in the past. It's like, if you're a fan of that show, Severance, it's a bit like that.

**Chris Williamson** (3:29)
It sort of suggests to me that if there was a way for the remembering self to remember everything the experiencing self experienced, that this would give us a fuller picture. Maybe we would be choosing from a deeper, more rich data set to be able to make our decision about the vacation, whatever it is. Or we once had a conversation with somebody about going to Tulum, but I forgot about that conversation about Tulum. We went to Tulum and Tulum sucked or it was great or whatever.

**Charan Ranganath** (4:02)
Yeah, it's a great question. And Kahneman felt like it was in fact quite irrational that we don't have this capability to access the experiencing self when we remember. And to me, it's actually quite the opposite. If you talk to people who have what's called highly superior autobiographical memory, these are people who have just this incredible database of information that they've experienced. They could tell you on a particular date, seven years ago, exactly what they had for breakfast, what the weather was, who won the sports matches that day. Unbelievable. And if you read descriptions, many of these people talk about it as torture. They say it's something that they wouldn't wish on their worst enemy. I mean, they are often plagued by memories.