Solar Energy's Second Act — EP 88 Joel Jean

Ashlee Vance (0:00)

All right, today we have a tale of woe and hope. The tale of woe is that the US has fallen terribly behind when it comes to solar technology. China is far and away the dominant player in manufacturing solar cells and panels. It is also building more solar panels than the rest of the world combined. This is an issue if you think solar has a future, and I think it has a very bright future. But there's a moment in time coming up where the US could actually have a chance to compete again. This all hinges on some solar technology that revolves around things called perovskites. These are crystals that are potentially cheaper and more efficient than the silicon-based technology we've been using for decades. The US and China are in a race to figure out who can master perovskites first. Our guest today is Joel Jean. He is the CEO and co-founder of Swift Solar. They have been doing some of the most pioneering work on perovskites for more than a decade. They think they are close to being able to manufacture these things. Joel is going to walk us through the last few decades of solar technology history, how we got to where we are and how perovskites work and how they could potentially create a much more competitive landscape for the US and the rest of the world. Against China, we will see.

I'm Ashlee Vance. This is Core Memory. Here we go to learn about solar technology.

Joel, thank you for coming. How are you?

Joel Jean (2:00)

Thank you. I'm good. Friday afternoon.

Ashlee Vance (2:03)

I think we met for the first time a couple of months ago. Yeah, it gave me nostalgia. You guys are near where Tesla's original headquarters were, which I didn't visit back when it was actually happening. But when I was doing my book on Elon, I like to go to all these places just to feel what they were like. And then I saw all these photos from back in the day, but it's a little historic chunk of Silicon Valley.

Joel Jean (2:35)

Yeah, right off of Industrial in San Carlos. We actually had one of the Tesla co-founders in the office once and he was like, I think this used to be our building.

Ashlee Vance (2:44)

Yeah, I mean, it is quite possible that as they expanded, they actually were in your building at some point.

Joel Jean (2:52)

Anyway, a little bit of good history there.

Ashlee Vance (2:55)

Yeah.

So I want to use this as an excuse to get to know the solar industry better.

And I feel like from where I sit, a lot of what you see is clearly solar has improved in price and performance at this very steady clip over the last, whatever, 20, 30 years.

And then, so you've got this story of solar is succeeding in a lot of ways. And then you have this story of, and we'll get into all this, and so maybe I'll misspeak at some point, but my impression is that the United States invented a lot of the technology that is at the heart of the global solar industry, but that over the last 15 to 20 years, China really perfected manufacturing this stuff and has just become the dominant player in solar, both from a manufacturing standpoint and from actually deploying solar technology. And if you read the news, I mean, people would say these days, they will install more solar this year, I think, than the rest of the world combined. And so it really looks like this incredibly dominant force. I know the US does still have some solar manufacturers. I know Germany has been big on solar for years, but to me, from where I sit, it really looks like this is very China heavy story. This is like not great for the United States, possibly not great for the world. I don't know, maybe it is, if they could just make tons of cheap solar, but solar is going to be a thing, which it is, and continue on this trajectory. It seems like perhaps not the US shining moment. And so, I don't know, can you, after he's rambled all of that out, I mean, is this generally true? What is the state of the solar industry, to start with a very broad question?

Joel Jean (4:56)

Oh, my gosh, I love it.

There's so much there. I mean, the, yeah, I mean, tell a story, start from the beginning. Yeah. It's like, where does solar start? It started in 1954 with the Bell Labs, right? The very first silicon solar cell was invented at Bell Labs.

Ashlee Vance (5:12)