Ray Dalio on Success, Failure and Meaningful Work

Ray Dalio (0:01)

That notion of, I'm evolving, I'm learning, I'm improving, and I'm contributing to evolution by those around me is something that I think it produces a successful life, and it could produce it in many different ways. Look, I have a view that anybody can make mistakes.

It's okay to make mistakes. You just can't not learn from them. Pain plus reflection equals progress.

Michael Gervais (0:38)

Welcome back, or welcome to the Finding Mastery Podcast. I am your host, Dr. Michael Gervais, by trade and training a high-performance psychologist. Many times, the most meaningful work we can do in our lives grows out of our childhood interests.

So picture, if you will, a young boy from a modest middle-class neighborhood who is deeply fascinated by the stock market. Already at age 12, he's developed a sophisticated understanding, viewing the market as an intricate and complex game. His intense interest is so much more than just a passing childhood phase. He starts to take action, consistently investing, earning from his part-time job, and learning valuable lessons along the way.

He's planting the seeds of a lifelong passion. This is the real-life story of Ray Dalio, the visionary behind Bridgewater Associates, the world's largest hedge fund, which manages $124 billion in assets. Ray's path from humble beginnings to financial legend and one of times 100 most influential people in the world is a case study in self-awareness, resilience, and the transformative power of foundational principles. So Ray's approach to challenges, both in the stock market and in life, offers a unique perspective on navigating complexities with grace and determination. In our conversation, Ray opens up about the pillars of his success, radical transparency, idea meritocracy, and meditation. These aren't just corporate buzzwords for him. They're essential life tools for navigating decisions and relationships. So whether you're charting your course in business or sport or family or art or any other area, Ray's insights offer keys to unlock your potential and to create a life that resonates with your deepest aspirations. So with that, let's dive right into this incredible conversation with the legend, Ray Dalio.

Ray, how are you?

Ray Dalio (2:51)

I'm great, thank you. How are you?

Michael Gervais (2:53)

I am fantastic as well. And I've been wanting to speak with you for a long time. And so just as we get going, thank you for spending the time to share your wisdom, to share best practices and to share your story and who you are.

And so I'm really looking forward to this conversation.

Ray Dalio (3:09)

Well, thank you for letting me do it. I'm in a phase in my life which I'm trying to pass along with things that have been most valuable. So this is a great symbiotic relationship.

Michael Gervais (3:19)

It is great. Okay, good. And you've got a lot to say. There's so many directions that we could take this conversation. I mean, your body of work is so extensive and the success that you've had and the depth of the psychological topics that have led you is so real.

And so if we just started with first learning more about Ray, the person, you know, and if you could just point to one or two stories that helped shape you, that would give us a feel and some context of who you are.

Ray Dalio (3:54)

I'll be happy to give you a couple of stories. The ones I would give you about are mostly about failures in learning.

I think the most important thing is I grew up as a lower middle class kid whose father was a jazz musician. My mom was a stay at home and I worked at an early age. I would paper route and I caddied and so on. I got hooked on markets early. When I caddied, I played around in the stock market when I was 12 or so and it was a game. It was like a game. It plays as a game and I didn't like school. I wasn't a good student. I drove my parents crazy.

I got into CW Post College on probation and I loved college. I did great at the top of my class, went to Harvard Business School, continued to play the markets. Very independent thinker and came out and I think I had a lot of audaciousness.

Michael Gervais (5:10)

So let's go back to when you were 12 This is when you first started investing. What was that beginnings like for you? Was there a spark that you knew this was my thing or was it another way to express risk?

Can you open up that moment for us?

Ray Dalio (5:27)

The people I would caddy for and I would talk about the markets. So they were the ones, you know, like, okay.