JRE MMA Show #183 with Rico Verhoeven

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:01)
Joe Rogan Podcast, checking in.

**Joe Rogan** (0:03)
The Joe Rogan Experience.

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:06)
Trained by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.

**Joe Rogan** (0:13)
Good to see you, champ.

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:15)
Yes, sir.

**Joe Rogan** (0:15)
We were just trying to figure out how long it's been. What year, when was the last one we did together? I think it was 2017, almost 10 years.

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:23)
Yeah.

**Joe Rogan** (0:23)
Or it might have been 16

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:24)
Yeah, I think so. Yes, sir.

**Joe Rogan** (0:27)
Was it really?

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:29)
So number 71 Wow. Yeah. That's crazy. He has the data. He's got it. I was like...
Maybe we just got punched in the head a little bit too much. A little bit.

**Joe Rogan** (0:40)
Well, listen, man, I want to tell you that that fight with Usyk was one of the craziest things that I've ever seen in my life. Never in my life did I think a guy who would go straight from kickboxing... Did you have any professional boxing matches?

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:57)
One.

**Joe Rogan** (0:58)
One.

**Rico Verhoeven** (0:58)
One professional... I've been boxing for 15 years.

**Joe Rogan** (1:01)
Of course. Well, also, you're arguably the greatest kickboxer of all time. Thank you.

**Rico Verhoeven** (1:06)
Thank you. Appreciate that.

**Joe Rogan** (1:07)
And you have a fight with arguably the greatest boxer in the heavyweight division ever. He's in The Conversation.

**Rico Verhoeven** (1:15)
100%.

**Joe Rogan** (1:15)
100% in The Conversation of the greatest boxer in the heavyweight division ever.
And you won 10 fucking rounds, man. You won 10 rounds.

**Rico Verhoeven** (1:24)
Yes, I was close to that. Yeah.

**Joe Rogan** (1:25)
I mean, I don't give a fuck what those judges were saying. Those judges were trying to say it was close, like it was almost like you were up... I think one of them had you up by one round, and the other ones had a draw.

**Rico Verhoeven** (1:36)
Yeah. I think that's...

**Joe Rogan** (1:38)
That's a crime. If that went to the scorecards, and somehow or another you lost that decision, that would have been a crime.

**Rico Verhoeven** (1:46)
I know. And I gotta be honest, I think we were straight jumping into it. So, and like, I think that's the hard part of it. It like...
I don't like losing, but I don't... If it happens, it happens. But I think that's the part that makes it even harder, that I've... It felt so in just and...

**Joe Rogan** (2:10)
It felt in just. The stoppage felt in just. It didn't seem like it made sense. It was like they were looking for a way to stop the fight.

**Rico Verhoeven** (2:17)
Exactly. But next to that, like...
You say this as a combat sports... commentator for years and pray... You've been in the sport for so many years, and all other professional boxers and commentators, etc. They all see the fight a certain way. Like, you saw it, like how I experienced it. And then when we look at the scorecards, we get, like, a totally different fight. Like, what is going on there? And that is, for me, where the toughness is of the whole experience.

**Joe Rogan** (2:54)
Right. It's very difficult to accept. And if you had lost by decision, it would have been insanity. And we've seen those insane decisions before, and I never know what's going on. You know, I don't want to think it's corruption. But it's almost worse if it's incompetence. If you have someone who's judging a fight, which is like the most pivotal fight, arguably, of your career, you think about how long you've been reigning as the heavyweight champion of kickboxing, for like a decade, which is crazy at the highest level. Especially at the heavyweight division. It is so hard to stay at the top.
Nobody does. Everybody's like, even in the UFC, it's like one, two fights, and then they fall off.
If you were to be the heavyweight champion and have fucking wars like Jamal Ben Saddique, that fight, like some of these fights, if you had wars, and to come out on top every single fucking time. And then you have this enormous fight, and you have terrible judging.
Terrible judging. And it's like, it's almost worse if it's incompetence, because if you've got these people that don't know what they're watching, and they're calling, like their eyes, their decision makes a difference about whether it's a W or an L, and it doesn't make any sense. It's not fair. It's not right. I think at this point in time, they should really seriously consider having alternative scoring. I think there should be more. One of the things I like about Glory is that Glory has more than three judges. What do they have, four or five?