Innovation Expert: Embrace the Creative Process and Find Joy in the Unknown | JoAnn Garbin

JoAnn Garbin (0:00)

When you start in a life that you don't want to lead for the next however many years, you got two decisions, like, I'm just gonna take what I got, and I'm gonna go with it, and that's the breaks, or I'm gonna figure out how to change this.

Michael Gervais (0:13)

What does it take to go from nothing to something, and then scale it into meaningful impact? Welcome back, or welcome to the Finding Mastery podcast. I am your host, Dr. Michael Gervais, by trade and training, a high-performance psychologist. I want to introduce you to someone you may not know, unless you're in the innovation space, JoAnn Garbin. She's a technology entrepreneur with a 25-year track record of turning big ideas into reality. And she's the co-author of the Insider's Guide to Innovation at Microsoft.

JoAnn Garbin (0:42)

I think innovation, what we go to is its value creation. So it's not just about delivering an idea or something new, but it's fundamentally bringing value to other people from their perspective.

Michael Gervais (0:56)

So how do you help folks understand where fear sits in the innovation process and how to work well with fear?

JoAnn Garbin (1:02)

For a lot of people, even just sharing idea is scary. What if it's dumb?

Michael Gervais (1:06)

What will they think of me?

JoAnn Garbin (1:07)

That'll never work.

Michael Gervais (1:09)

And your response is?

JoAnn Garbin (1:10)

Not my person. Next.

Michael Gervais (1:12)

Right, yeah. JoAnn has led innovation teams at some of the world's most influential companies, including Microsoft. And she's got so much to offer about how to work well with failure, how to navigate uncertainty, and how to turn your idea into something that can change the world.

JoAnn Garbin (1:27)

The open space needs to be a space of possibility. If you participate in the creative process, you will tap into something that is fundamentally joyful. It is just a positive feedback loop that is fundamental to our nature, and that's where we find joy.

Michael Gervais (1:45)

So with that, let's jump into this week's conversation with JoAnn Garbin.

JoAnn, I have really enjoyed your book, and so we have a shared common path at Microsoft, that we've both had an upfront view on how they build what they build. Every company has its challenges, but the power of innovation that is coming through, and your capture of how innovation really works, I love it. I love what you've done with your co-author. It's amazing to have you here to open up how innovation works, from your take, from your lived experience. And I'd like to focus on three things primarily. One is, I want to talk about what sits under innovation from the lens of curiosity. I want to talk about fear, and I want to talk about humanity. But before we dive into those three, I want to read you a quote from Alex Honnold. Do you know who Alex Honnold is?

JoAnn Garbin (2:52)

I don't know that name.

Michael Gervais (2:53)

So Alex Honnold is one of the most significant athletes of our time. He's widely known for climbing El Capitan without any support. So it's no ropes, just his hands. Yeah, no, no, right, just his hands, his feet, and his head. His wits about himself. And if he makes a mistake at 3,000 feet, the consequences are real. So I would like to read you a quote from him and just kind of see how you respond to it. So Alex says, I mean a lot of people look at the stuff that I'm doing. They're like, oh, that's crazy because they can't imagine the mental side of climbing. But for me, the mental side has always kind of come natural. But the physical side is a lot harder. Pause. This is one of the best in the world at what he does. So I look at people who are physically gifted. I'm like, what's so crazy? How can they do that?

So I ask you here, is there an analog between risk taking and looking at how other people are doing it and being either inspired by it or encumbered by what the extraordinaries are doing? Because oftentimes the extraordinaries create a spotlight. They can create a glow. They can create a shadow. There's a lot of things that we can be in reference to what the greats are showing us. So there's a two part question here. One is Alex is exceptional at calculating risk. And he's also exceptional at the thing he does. So it creates an experience for the observers. So there's a two part question embedded in his insights. How do you dance with that quote of his?