How Love Turns You Insane - Dr Max Butterfield - #1069

**Chris Williamson** (0:00)
Dr. Max Butterfield, welcome to the show.

**Max Butterfield** (0:02)
Chris, thank you for having me. Please call me Max.

**Chris Williamson** (0:05)
No, Dr. Max Butterfield, you rip. I absolutely love your content. I think you're so fantastic.

**Max Butterfield** (0:11)
Oh, I really appreciate it. I am shocked every day when somebody tells me that because I'm nobody, you know? I just have been telling people who I am every day for the last year, and it kind of started to take hold, I guess.

**Chris Williamson** (0:25)
Yeah, and there's very few people doing evidence-based relationship advice, especially in short form on social media. So it doesn't surprise me that it's going well. PhD in experimental psychology, master's in clinical psych, master's in experimental psych, bachelor's in psych, and some additional work in religion, law, and languages.

**Max Butterfield** (0:41)
That's a couple of things. I really, in first grade, I decided I liked school and I was never going to leave. So still here 30 years later.

**Chris Williamson** (0:49)
All right. I'm going to get you to react to something straight off the bat. Norwegian biathlete, Sturla Home leg raid. Have you seen this?

**Max Butterfield** (0:57)
Yeah.

**Chris Williamson** (0:57)
Okay. So this 28-year-old guy chose the Olympics as a place to shoot his shot with his ex after he won the bronze in the men's 20-kilometer biathlon in a viral post. After his win in the interview, this guy confessed to cheating on the love of his life, revealing that she dumped him after he came clean a week ago, and said he was committing social suicide in the hopes of winning her back. It seems like his plan backfired since his ex, who has remained anonymous, reportedly told Norwegian tabloid VG that it's hard to forgive even after a declaration of love in front of the whole world. So for the people that haven't seen it, Dean will cut it in now.

**SPEAKER_3** (1:36)
Six months ago, I met the love of my life, the world's most beautiful, wonderful person in the world. Three months ago, I made the biggest mistake of my life and cheated on her.

**Chris Williamson** (1:46)
As you can see, that guy used probably the crowning moment of his entire career, maybe his entire life. You've worked from a child to do this thing. Biathlon is the rifle shooting with the skiing thing, I think.

**Max Butterfield** (2:00)
I believe so, yeah.

**Chris Williamson** (2:03)
Way more of an expert on relationships than on fucking biathlon. He chose that moment, the crowning moment as he gets to do the interview. Could have thanked his mom, could have thanked God, could have thanked all the hard work, used it as the opportunity to try and do that. Dissect this from a science-based lens for me, please. What's going on?

**Max Butterfield** (2:20)
Well, I mean, the first thing I want to know is, was this planned? Did he think this through? Because to me, that is very different. If he's like, okay, I know what I'm going to do, I'm going to try to get her back, and he's rationally got some reasons, or if this was just like, hey, I'm in front of the camera, I'm all excited, I don't know what to say, I don't know how to regulate myself, let me just let this fly. I think the results are going to be the same regardless, but the feedback I would have for him would be very different, depending on whether he did this on the fly.

**Chris Williamson** (2:51)
Give me both of you notes.

**Max Butterfield** (2:52)
Well, I mean, so if he did this on the fly, I would, going forward, I don't know how you walk this back, first of all. I mean, like you said, he shot his shot here in front of the whole world. This is his crowning achievement.

**Chris Williamson** (3:03)
He shot his shot after shooting many shots, actually.

**Max Butterfield** (3:05)
That's exactly what, I'm going through my head, it's like, biathlete, just stick to your 50 meters or whatever it is, let's not shoot this kind of shot, in this situation, right? So, that's what I would tell him. I think in a lot of ways, you've got to use humor there to defuse the situation with the individual because he just blew up his life, really, because this is not just going to affect his relationship with this woman. Now, every woman on the planet is like, oh, this guy's a cheater. Okay, cool. And that's not the message that I don't think you want that out there. And again, this is what I would tell him, just straight off the cuff, is like, look man, we've got two things to do. One is repair the damage, and then the second is, what do we do for you to help you regulate and think through what you're going to do in the future? Now, if he planned this out, I would ask questions instead. And my first question would be like, what were you thinking? What was going through your head here? Because I don't know, honestly. I think there is this desire probably to tell her and tell the world that like, no, I'm a good guy. I'm trying to do the right thing. And that would be my hope here, is that ultimately he's trying to do the right thing and he feels bad. And that kind of shame and guilt that you would feel after cheating is going to motivate people to great lengths to try to repair and restore. So if we're thinking about, is this guy a good guy? He might actually be a really good guy who made a mistake or he might be an idiot.