« F**k around and find out » : Une conversation avec Shawn Layden, ancien président des PlayStation Studios

**SPEAKER_1** (0:01)
Welcome to all on PSI, our news media and analysis of the video game landscape. Welcome to PSI, your French media for video games news and analysis.
After prestigious interviews alongside Shuhei Yoshida, Yuka Kitamura, Greg Edmonson or even Jordan Mechner, we couldn't stop ourselves on the right track. After iconic guests like Yoshida, Kitamura, Edmonson and Mechner, we are back for more.
I am delighted to announce this new interview with Shawn Layden, former president of PlayStation Studios. Today I am thrilled to welcome Shawn Layden, former chairman of PlayStation Studios. If you follow the video game industry closely, you know how much this man's voice matters, sometimes even fluctuates, with always relevant opinions on important subjects. If you know the industry, you know his voice matters, always relevant, sometimes provocative. We will exchange with him on the video game between passionate. We will talk games, patient to patient. The video game in 2026, the productions of tomorrow, the French games, memories of his prolific career, without forgetting to address the socio-economic problems at the heart of the industry. We will cover 2026, future hits, French games, current memories and the industry's biggest challenge. No need to make you wait any longer. I will pass the mic to Geoffrey, Yacine and Shawn of course. Let's welcome Geoffrey, Yacine and Shawn. Très bonnes écoutes à vous toutes et tous. Enjoy the show.

**Yacine** (1:42)
Hello, hello, everyone. Welcome to PSI.
We are very happy and very honored, sorry to be with Shawn Layden, former president of PlayStation. Hi, Mr. Layden, how are you?

**Shawn Layden** (1:54)
Good afternoon, boys. Yeah, we're doing really well. Nice to see you.

**Yacine** (1:57)
Yeah, thank you very much. I don't know if you can see, but I have some PlayStation games behind me.

**Shawn Layden** (2:02)
I can't see them yet.

**Geoffrey** (2:04)
I have some in front of me.

**Yacine** (2:06)
We've watched many interviews of yours, and we've read many interviews of yours, and you talked about The Last of Us, Uncharted, The Getaway. I don't know if you can see The Getaway somewhere.

**Shawn Layden** (2:16)
Yeah.

**Yacine** (2:16)
Yeah.

**Shawn Layden** (2:17)
It's in there.

**Yacine** (2:17)
The Free Horizon, Spider-Man.

**Geoffrey** (2:19)
It's a Jackix or a Jack-

**Yacine** (2:22)
A Jack 2

**Geoffrey** (2:22)
Jack 2

**Yacine** (2:24)
And I have the PlayStation 1 Merc. So yeah, there's just kind of a lot.

**Geoffrey** (2:29)
He has everything. Yeah.

**Yacine** (2:32)
Well, thank you very much again for granting us this interview. Let's dive right in.
We've decided to give this interview somewhat of a title. The title is Fuck Around and Find Out, because that's the state of mind we think the video games industry is in right now. And with everything that's going on, price increases, layoffs, generative AI, in which we'll go in detail in other questions. We just wanted to ask you a general question first. Are you really optimistic about the future of the industry, as you stated in other interviews?

**Shawn Layden** (3:10)
Well, you have to be, right?

**Yacine** (3:11)
Yeah.

**Shawn Layden** (3:12)
Yeah. I think so.

**Geoffrey** (3:12)
Yeah. Yeah.

**Yacine** (3:13)
But there's a difference between you have to be and you are. That's the question we wanted to ask you.

**Shawn Layden** (3:18)
Well, I have to be, so I am. It's like what my grandfather used to say, when you have no choice, you have no problem.

**Geoffrey** (3:24)
Okay.

**Shawn Layden** (3:25)
And I have no problem. I'm optimistic for the game industry. I think it's going through transitional phase as everything does. But it's not disappearing. It's not going away. It's not turning into the hula hoop business, which was big until it wasn't, or the guitar hero business, which was big until it wasn't.
The game business goes through these different kinds of cycles. And I think what we're finding now is we've grown to the edge of the financial universe. There'll be dragons there if you drive much further. So we're trying to re-align our abilities to create amazing entertainment in a way that's financially sustainable, that rewards teams, that gives consumers really what they're looking for. And yeah, we'll figure this out. We always do.

**Yacine** (4:15)
Yeah, we hope so as well. I don't know if you watched The Office, the US television series.

**Shawn Layden** (4:22)
I watched The British Office.

**Yacine** (4:23)
I watched The British. So in the American version, there's a character whose name is Andy Bernard. And he said in a famous quote, I wish there was a way to know you are in the good old days before you've actually left them.
That was the introduction to my other question. In your 30 years, 32, I think, at Sony PlayStation, you've covered pretty much everything from the ATP era to the 4K 60 FPS times we live in now with everything that comes in between in terms of costs and risks. In other interviews, you've understandably conveyed a sense of nostalgia and pride about the PS1 times when everything was new and had to be created. Now that you can look back and reminisce, can you say without the shadow of a doubt that it was better before in the game industry, or is it going to be better going forward? What about the good old days?