E63: Insurrection indictments, human rights in the US and abroad, groundbreaking MS study & more

**Jason Calacanis** (0:01)
Look at Friedberg.

**Friedberg** (0:02)
He's like, this is so awkward. I can't wait.

**Chamath Palihapitiya** (0:04)
You literally brought popcorn, didn't you?

**Friedberg** (0:06)
I'm just watching the show.
You brought popcorn. He's like, I want to see round three. I have nothing to say today. I'm just going to sit here and watch. I brought popcorn. I got my chili roasted pistachio nuts.

**Jason Calacanis** (0:39)
Are we really going to do this as the top story? I mean, this is the third time we've tried to do this story.
Do we give the background Sacks or no?

**David Sacks** (0:47)
We wouldn't have had to do it over and over again if you didn't act so hysterical.

**Friedberg** (0:50)
There we go.

**Jason Calacanis** (0:51)
The first one you killed.

**David Sacks** (0:53)
No, you killed it.

**Jason Calacanis** (0:54)
No, the first one you killed.

**David Sacks** (0:56)
Yeah, because it wasn't even on the docket and it wasn't even newsworthy.

**Jason Calacanis** (1:00)
Okay. And the second one I killed?

**David Sacks** (1:02)
Because you came across like a stark raving lunatic.

**Jason Calacanis** (1:05)
I spiked it the second time because I was so infuriated by your cavalier attitude towards it.

**David Sacks** (1:10)
What are you worried about my attitude for? Why don't you just focus on making your own good points?

**Chamath Palihapitiya** (1:15)
Here's the thing.

**Jason Calacanis** (1:17)
I was so correct. I was so correct.

**Chamath Palihapitiya** (1:20)
The two of you...

**Friedberg** (1:21)
Let him go, Chamath. Let him go.

**Jason Calacanis** (1:23)
You guys got popcorn?

**David Sacks** (1:24)
Let's hear this idiot try to blame his own hysteria on me.

**Jason Calacanis** (1:28)
You said that January 6 was overblown and of course...

**David Sacks** (1:32)
No, I said it was a disgrace. I said it was an embarrassment. It was an embarrassment to the country. I said it was wrong. But you want to inflate it. You're engaging in classic Washington threat inflation.
And there's two problems with that. One is you're going to take your eye off the ball of the real issues facing the country, like inflation, the economy and economic anxiety, like COVID, like crime, like schools. I mean, these are the issues that Americans care about, not a riot that happened over a year ago. And if you and the Democrats keep talking about this and focus on it, on MSNBC, to the exclusion of the issues that really matter, I'll see you in November, because you're going to get slaughtered in this midterm election. It's going to be a landslide. But the other problem with it is with this threat inflation is that it justifies the expansion of surveillance powers and prosecutorial powers by the Justice Department, by the Justice Department and other branches of our government who want to basically go after the so-called domestic terrorism.
That will lead to an infringement on civil liberties, just like the expansion of those agencies did after 9-11. And so I think we should all be concerned about it. Now look, are these Oath Keepers a bunch of idiots? Yeah, there were 11 Oath Keepers at that rally.
They broke into the Capitol.

**Chamath Palihapitiya** (2:52)
Wait a minute, wait a minute. You're saying an old fat guy with an eye patch and a hat that says, Oath Keeper lifetime member is not credible to you?

**David Sacks** (3:04)
Exactly. I mean, look, this is these guys are, they're not unlike the Antifa, you know, people in Portland who are trying to burn down buildings or Chase Abuddin's parents who are domestic terrorists. I mean, yeah, this is a small number of knuckleheads who broke into the Capitol. They should be prosecuted.
They're guilty of saying this leader is saying intemperate things. But was this going to be a coup to take over the Capitol? I don't think so.

**Jason Calacanis** (3:33)
Okay, let me cut the story.

**David Sacks** (3:34)
And if you want to focus on that to the exclusion of the real issues facing the country, like I said, this landslide in November, this red wave is going to be even bigger.

**Jason Calacanis** (3:41)
Just to your point about my focus every week here on the number one tech podcast in the world and on the number six tech podcast in the world, this week in startups, I focus on all of those issues. But let's read, because we can chew gum and walk at the same time. Let's read what happened on Thursday. The FBI arrested 11 members of the Oath Keepers on sedition charges, and the House Committee subpoenaed Facebook, Google, Reddit and Twitter after insufficient responses to the January 6 riots or insurrection, whichever term you prefer. The leader of the Oath Keepers, which is an organization that claims over 30,000 members primarily in the military and police.