E203 - Dr. Justin Sledge: The Occult, Witch Trials & the Forbidden Teachings of Gnosticism

**André Duqum** (0:00)
How much of early religion is really decided by who won the fight?

**Dr. Justin Sledge** (0:04)
All of it. The world of Western Esotericism has been a world greatly diminished, hunted, repressed, suppressed. Folks have been banned and burned. We have let those in power, that's a lie. And that lie has robbed us of some of the most important spiritual technologies of what it is to be human. So we have Hermeticism, Kabbalah, the occult, witchcraft, and Gnosticism. What brings them all together is they've all been rejected, not just rejected, but suppressed.

**André Duqum** (0:30)
You brought some books with you.

**Dr. Justin Sledge** (0:31)
Yeah.

**André Duqum** (0:32)
What is that?

**Dr. Justin Sledge** (0:33)
This book was actively targeted for destruction by the church. It survived unimaginable things. We know that women are being initiated into these mysteries. But there's a long history of the feminine as derivative, as somehow less than, and that is just have catastrophic consequences. I'll give you one example of this.
Between 40,000 and 60,000 people, mostly women, were executed. In the 15th century, wild men, this is what happens when conspiracy theories get political power and impunity. And now we're just repeating the same mistakes. But I think that we're going to see more spiritual creativity in the next century than maybe in the last five centuries combined. The books are real. We can translate them. And we're now unlocking their secrets. Let's do it.

**André Duqum** (1:21)
Hey everyone, welcome back to the Know Thyself Podcast. Our guest today is the mind behind the channel Esoterica on YouTube and community with over a million subscribers. He is one of the most grounded voices I could find to take us into the mystical, into the Gnostic, into the hidden quarters of religion without what we often find collapsing into infinite skepticism or collapsing into belief.
He's a trained scholar of philosophy and Western Esotericism, Dr. Justin Sledge. Thank you for being here.

**Dr. Justin Sledge** (1:52)
Thank you, Andre. It's very kind of you to invite me in very kind words and looking forward to our conversation.

**André Duqum** (1:57)
I am so excited to dive in and just like learn from you. I think you're such an incredible mind and I feel the passion through all the videos that you record, how much you actually love the topic. And we'll dive into the witch trials, ancient Kabbalah mysticism, how religion and early mystics have, the story and narratives have been shaped throughout history. But where I want to really start, because I feel like we can set the stage really well for individuals. And also what I've just been exploring personally is like how to even approach these topics in a way that is actually fruitful. How does reason and logic come into the picture exploring something inherently non-rational at times? When you call yourself a skeptic, you don't mean what most people mean when they say that word online. So how would you define that term?
How it relates to you?

**Dr. Justin Sledge** (2:53)
Skepticism in the classical sense of the word doesn't mean disbelieving in things. It certainly doesn't mean going out there and trying to disprove what people believe. It's a very petulant way of existing, honestly.
But skepticism in the classical tradition simply means withholding judgment. It simply means take a look at the data, take a look at the history, take a look at the books, take a look at the arguments, and say, you know what? I just don't know. And it's okay for me not to know. And these arguments are compelling in some ways and strange in others. And so my task as a scholar is not to come down on one side of the fence about whether this stuff is true or not. My job is to bracket my own desires to know that kind of thing. And simply say, this is what we have. And if that's what we have, that's it. And so skepticism, for me, means just simply withholding judgment.
And when I can practice that, and when I do it hopefully well, it means that the texts can speak for themselves. The traditions speak for themselves. And I get to be that voice, which is a great honor for me. Because these are, the world of Western Esotericism has been a world greatly diminished, hunted, repressed, suppressed. Books have been banned and burned.
And at this juncture in history, I get to be one of the voices through which this material gets to live. And it's very important for me to lift up their voice and to put my voice back behind it. And that part of that process is that skeptical process, just withholding judgment. And when I withhold it, their voice can come through.