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Don't Get Cross With Me

Data Over Dogma

October 27, 2025

Giving you good biblical data is our cross to bear, but what that cross looks like and what it symbolizes is a question! We're all very aware of the traditional crucifix or cross as a symbol of Christianity, but how did the thing that killed Jesus come to represent his followers? And why?

Speakers Dan Beecher, Dan McClellan

TopicsSociety & CultureHistory

SPEAKER_1 (0:01)

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SPEAKER_3 (0:33)

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SPEAKER_4 (0:47)

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SPEAKER_3 (0:50)

Cut the camera, they see us.

SPEAKER_5 (0:52)

Only pay for what you need at libertymutual.com.

Dan Beecher (0:54)

Liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty.

SPEAKER_3 (0:57)

Savings very underwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company and affiliates excludes Massachusetts.

Dan McClellan (1:01)

So when, when you go to the Trump rally and you see the people wheeling around their full cross, that is historically inaccurate and they should know better.

Dan Beecher (1:10)

It's also symbolically inaccurate, but that's okay. That's a, that's a question for another time.

Dan McClellan (1:19)

Hey everybody, I'm Dan McClellan.

Dan Beecher (1:21)

And I'm Dan Beecher.

Dan McClellan (1:23)

And you're listening to the Data Over Dogma podcast where we increase public access to the academic study of the Bible and religion, and we combat the spread of misinformation about the same. How are things today, Dan?

Dan Beecher (1:35)

Things are good, man. Today, as of today, as we record, so, you know, a week and a half ago for all y'all, we won a Signal Award today.

Dan McClellan (1:47)

Yeah, we got the gold. There were a few golds in our category, but we also had the added distinction of winning the Listener's Choice Award in our category of religion and spiritualities.

Dan Beecher (1:58)

Yeah, that's you guys. You guys did that. So thanks to everyone who voted for us, and we won a major award, a major award.

Dan McClellan (2:10)

And we were talking about how we need to get the, there are medals, well, trophies, that can be requested, that we have to pay for. Because, you know, there are a lot of winners. I imagine they're like, can't be sending these out to everybody.

So anyway, hopefully in the near future, for those of you who are watching the YouTube video, you will see these awards, these trophies in the background.

Dan Beecher (2:40)

Yeah, we're very fancy, you guys. I don't know if you know this, but we are fancy boys.

Dan McClellan (2:47)

And as of your hearing of this podcast, I will also hopefully successfully be on the other side of a dreaded procedure that afflicts men of a certain age, specifically 45

Dan Beecher (3:00)

Thank God you mentioned the colonoscopy. I think that that's a very important thing. But if you're watching on the YouTube, you will see Dan take swigs of a very bright yellow concoction that is, I understand, to be a lemon-lime sports drink mixed with the most hate, mixed with some stuff that, well, we don't need to talk about it.

Dan McClellan (3:30)

I read these instructions again and again and again and again and again. And then when I'm ready to do the thing, I look back and I'm like, I just want to double-check. Yes, it does say, dump an entire bottle of Miralax into this bottle of Gatorade. That's seven doses of Miralax. And I got to down like three of those.

Dan Beecher (3:58)

So, Dan's going to be clean as a whistle, everybody.

Dan McClellan (4:01)

Oh, yeah, they're going to be whistling going on for sure afterwards. Not before. No whistling at all before.

Yeah, no rolling the dice.

Dan Beecher (4:12)

It's a procedure that I as an older man than you already know. So anyway, those of you who are of middle age will will relate. The rest of you have lots to look forward to. One of the things that you have to look forward to is the rest of our show, which we promise will be not overburdened with colonoscopy talk, though I can't make the same promise.

Dan McClellan (4:38)

The occasional quip, but yeah, we won't belabor the point. We won't belabor the point.

Dan Beecher (4:42)

Yeah, our after party, the bonus content for our patrons, I can't make any promises. We'll see. We'll see. But we got a lot to talk about on this show because today, so our astute listeners will remember that a couple weeks ago we talked about the star of David and how that became the symbol of Judaism and then of the nation of Israel and blah, blah, blah. Blah, blah, blah seems insensitive.

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