Coaching Session: Overcoming My Delegation Problems with Michael Bungay Stanier

**Jay Clouse** (0:00)
But the conclusion I've come to a bunch of times is like, actually what I have is a lack of courage.

**Michael Bungay Stanier** (0:05)
Right. Let me reframe it in a nicer way.

**Jay Clouse** (0:22)
Hello, my friend. Welcome back to another episode of Creator Science. Today's episode is going to be a little bit different. Today, I'm welcoming back on the show Michael Bungay Stanier. Michael's written several books, including The Coaching Habit, which may be the best-selling coaching book of this century with over a million copies sold and more than 15,000 five-star reviews on Amazon. This is the 10-year anniversary of The Coaching Habit. Actually, I was introduced to it through AltNBA.
If you haven't already read it, I highly recommend it. Get yourself a copy at the link in the show notes. Along with The Coaching Habit, Michael founded Box of Crayons, a learning and development company that has helped hundreds of organizations transform from advice-driven to curiosity-led. The accolades continue. In 2019, he was named the number one thought leader in coaching. In 2023, he won the Coaching Award from Thinkers 50, known as the Oscars of Management. He was the first Canadian Coach of the Year. He's been named a Global Coaching Guru since 2014
He was even a Rhodes Scholar. And while we're talking about impressive things, Michael is a member of the Lab and has been on this show once before, way back on episode 82, talking about how to set a worthy goal.
So what makes this episode different? Well, Michael heard me talk about some of the changes I'm trying to create in my business, knowing that I have a son on the way this fall. And a few weeks ago, he reached out to me and offered to do something I didn't expect, a live coaching session with me here on the podcast. Here's what he said, Jay, your delegation issue is probably hard change, not easy change. More tactics won't help. You already know the tactics. I can take you through a process that might help. It will uncover the foot on the brake, even if you're pumping the accelerator. And we could record it and consider it for your pod. Pod or not, happy to do this with you.
So yeah, obviously I'm going to say yes to that. And he's right, the thing I've been struggling with is I know I need to delegate more. I've read books, I know frameworks, but something keeps pulling me back in. Redoing people's work, second guessing the people I've hired, holding on to things I have no business continuing to hold on to. So I took him up on his gracious offer to see if we could knock myself out of the ruts that I've dug deep into my psyche.
This is one of the most vulnerable and most useful conversations I've had on the show. I hope you enjoy it. We'll get to that full coaching session with Michael Bungay Stanier right after this.

**SPEAKER_3** (2:52)
From sauce, dust, to nuggets.
It's Taco Bell's new Diablo Dusted Crispy Chicken Nuggets. Are they mild? If they were mild, we'd have to change the name to Little Rascal Nuggets or Minor Nuisance Nuggets. Definitely Diablo. New Diablo Dusted Crispy Chicken Nuggets. A brand new classic. Only at Taco Bell.
At participating US. Taco Bell locations for a limited time and while supplies last.

**SPEAKER_4** (3:22)
Pepsi Prebiotic Cola in Original and Cherry Vanilla.
That Pepsi tastes you low with no artificial sweeteners and three grams of prebiotic fiber. Pepsi Prebiotic Cola. Unbelievably Pepsi.

**Jay Clouse** (3:40)
Hello.

**Michael Bungay Stanier** (3:41)
Hey Jay, how are you doing?

**Jay Clouse** (3:42)
How are you Michael?

**Michael Bungay Stanier** (3:43)
I'm nice to see you. I'm all right, thank you.

**Jay Clouse** (3:46)
Nice to see you as well. I'm doing something different this time, which is because this is such a behind the scenes episode, I've already started the recording just so people can get just like a full sense of what's going on here. But I did want to start and see how things are going in your world.

**Michael Bungay Stanier** (4:02)
They're going pretty well.
I have fingers in too many pies. I just listened to your pod reflecting on the author gathering. And when you said James Clear, fewer strokes done better or whatever it is, I'm like, oh, so I'm the opposite.

**Jay Clouse** (4:22)
More strokes, lighter touch.

**Michael Bungay Stanier** (4:23)
You could call me Michael Murky as opposed to James Clear because I'm like too many things done in too much of a half-assed way. But that's not actually totally fair because I've got some people on my team who are doing amazing stuff.