Can Hypnosis REALLY Change Your Life? Answers from Dr. David Spiegel

David Spiegel (0:01)

Hypnosis is a state of highly focused attention. One of the things that happens in hypnosis is you put aside your ordinary assumptions of who you are and what you can do. Hypnosis is highly effective, and you don't get addicted to it. Be prepared to meet your better self.

Michael Gervais (0:17)

David, I'm an astute learner. I saw you try to hypnotize me.

Welcome back, or welcome to the Finding Mastery podcast. I am your host, Dr. Michael Gervais, by trade and training a high-performance psychologist. Now, we talk a lot here about the power of mental imagery. It is one of the foundational and fundamental tools that I use when working with individuals and teams and organizations. The idea is that you use all five of your senses to imagine and thereby unlock what might be possible for you. It turns out that's a close cousin to hypnosis, which is the topic of today's conversation. That word has become a bit taboo in scientific circles. It brings to mind magicians and black and white spinning spirals and traveling sideshows and cheap tricks. You're getting very sleepy. It does not have a strong scientific foundation, or does it? In truth and practice, hypnosis can be so much more. That's why I am thrilled to have a conversation with Dr. David Spiegel, professor of psychiatry at the Stanford School of Medicine and researcher in psycho-oncology and the neurobiology of therapeutic hypnosis.

Dr. Spiegel is a pioneer in the research on hypnosis. I do not say that lightly. His work over the past several decades is foundational in helping patients overcome deep-seated trauma, work through fears and anxieties, build new habits, break existing ones, and even guide cancer patients through the pain of treatment and recovery.

Now, this isn't the hypnosis that you see on daytime television with swinging pocket watches and heavy eyelids. That's not what this is. It's the science of the mind-body connection and a way of looking at how the non-conscious can be trained to influence, guide, and heal our bodies.

We'll also talk about how all of this does not require a physician or a therapist or even a hypnotist, but through Dr. Spiegel's game-changing app Reverie, it can be available to all of us. So with that, let's dive right into this mesmerizing conversation with Dr. David Spiegel. Dr. Spiegel, I am so happy to sit down with you. Your body of work in psychiatry and behavioral sciences, it's substantial and I'm really excited to dive in. But before we do that, let's just start with a simple, how are you?

David Spiegel (3:05)

I'm fine, Michael, and I'm very glad to be here with you. Good.

Michael Gervais (3:10)

So sometimes fine means a lot of things. So what does fine mean to you?

David Spiegel (3:16)

Fine means to me, ignoring most of what's going on in the world right now and doing something about the things I can. So that's why if it sounds, it was a perceptive comment, if it sounds guarded, it's because it is.

Michael Gervais (3:31)

Yeah, that's cool. And that probably is a first principle in your life, is to try to gate out some of the noise and get down into the signal of the controllables for you.

David Spiegel (3:43)

Yes, that's right. And there are better and worse ways of doing that.

Michael Gervais (3:46)

There are better and worse ways. Yeah, there are better.

So one of yours sounds like it's work and focusing on your research and your programs. And is that a fair statement?

David Spiegel (4:00)

You're right. Victor Frankl, the philosopher and Holocaust survivor said, one can endure almost any what if one has a why.

And finding, building meaning in life and helping other people is for me a big part of the why. And that's what I'm trying to do and I'm enjoying doing. It is.

Michael Gervais (4:24)

Okay, that is a big question to how you're, or a big answer to how you're doing is I'm committed to helping people find their meaning.

And then, do you find that yours has shifted over time? Your purpose, your sense of meaning in life, or is it something that's been relatively stable?

David Spiegel (4:44)

Well, I would say it's an interesting question. I would say it's been pretty consistent. I mean, you know, I'm the child of two doctors. I wanted to be a doctor. I am a doctor. I love doing it. I love helping people. And still, the best parts of my week, or when I work with a patient and help them deal with something that they were having trouble dealing with.

At the same time, as you get on in life, you begin to recognize your finitude.