Biblical Marriage With Jennifer Bird

SPEAKER_1 (0:00)

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Dan McClellan (0:31)

You see this in Paul's sexuality as well. Paul is very much, in my opinion, he's suggesting one, that passion is for the dirty, dirty Gentiles. Yes. Because sex is supposed to be holy and with honor, not with the passion of desire.

Dan Beecher (0:49)

So you need to be playing, no, none of this Luther Vandross in the bedroom. The Mormon Tabernacle Choir and that's it.

Dan McClellan (1:03)

Hey, everybody, I'm Dan McClellan.

Dan Beecher (1:05)

And I'm Dan Beecher.

Dan McClellan (1:06)

And you are listening to the Data Over Dogma podcast, where we increase public access to the academic study of the Bible and religion, and we combat the spread of misinformation about the same. How are things today, Dan?

Dan Beecher (1:18)

Good, man. This is gonna be a fun one. I am looking forward to it. I always say that, but this time it's actually true.

Tell us about our guest. We've got a wonderful guest today.

Dan McClellan (1:29)

Today we're talking about a friend of mine. I've been involved in a little group of scholars that include Dr. Jennifer Bird, who is a public scholar of the New Testament and early Christianity, and just released a phenomenal book entitled Marriage in the Bible, What Do the Texts Say? Dun dun dun. Dun dun dun, yeah. I think the audio book comes with, the audio book comes with dun dun dun, and every now and then a boing, boing, boing, boing, and some other sound effects that Dr. Bird recorded herself.

But we're here to talk about this book and to talk a little bit about what the public needs to know about marriage in the Bible and how it is quite a bit different from the way we tend to think about it and the way people tend to argue about it.

Dan Beecher (2:25)

Yeah, Jennifer Bird, welcome. Thank you for joining us today.

Jennifer Bird (2:28)

Thank you for having me. This is such a treat.

Dan Beecher (2:31)

Wonderful.

Dan McClellan (2:32)

Well, it's a treat for us. We're very happy to have you here. This is a very timely book.

I think this is something that, it is information, it's filled with information that a lot of people, a lot of people in the public don't really have. But I don't know.

Dan Beecher (2:46)

It kind of seems unnecessary because we all know one man, one woman, we're done. I don't know what, why do we need to have a whole book about it?

Dan McClellan (2:55)

I thought it was one man, one vote. But oh, oh, that's different.

Dan Beecher (3:00)

That's a different thing, Dan.

Dan McClellan (3:04)

Yeah, I think it is a timely book. The debates are getting ever more heated about this kind of stuff. And a lot of it retreats back to well, the Bible says X. And anyone familiar with our social media content knows that we're loath to suggest the Bible really says anything.

I get called out as a hypocrite for saying the Bible doesn't say anything, we create meaning with the text. And then in another video, I'll be like, the Bible says this. But it's like, look, you want every single video to be like, as we create meaning with the Bible, we produce it, like it's a shorthand.

Dan Beecher (3:43)

Dan, you don't even let us define words for crying out loud. Nothing means anything ever at all. So.

Jennifer Bird (3:49)

I like it, I like it.

Dan McClellan (3:51)

Yeah, I think a lot of scholars are like, I've got no problem with this.

Jennifer Bird (3:55)

Exactly, exactly.

Dan McClellan (3:58)

I enjoyed this book quite a bit. And as we were talking a little bit before we started recording, you have a lot of little supplementary, a lot of little sidebars and notes, and some of them more humorous than others. But there's a lot of great information in here about marriage in the Bible. And I think one of the interesting things, particularly when we talk about the Hebrew Bible, but also to some degree in the New Testament, is what word is not anywhere in the Bible related to the concept of marriage.