Are We Part of the ‘Optimisation Podcast’ Problem?

Jake Humphrey (0:03)

Hi there, welcome along to another episode of High Performance by myself and Damian. Hey buddy.

Damian Hughes (0:07)

Hi Jake, you alright?

Jake Humphrey (0:08)

Very good. This is an episode where we just sit and we talk about something that's on our minds. And there's something that's been on our minds for the last couple of weeks. You and I have been WhatsApping each other, talking about it in person. And to be honest, it's a slightly uncomfortable question, right? And the question is, are we part of the problem? Are we part of the grindset problem? Are we part of the grindslop issue that seems to be washing over everyone these days? Because when we first started High Performance, and this episode is going to take a little bit of vulnerability, a lot of honesty and quite a lot of reflection. When we started this, we were fascinated by winning. That was why we both came together by routine, by sacrifice, by discipline, by marginal gains. We spoke all the time, didn't we? Marginal gains, marginal gains. And we were interested in what extraordinary people did differently. And there's no doubt that some of that has certainly changed my life. You would probably argue the same. Some of it has changed your life.

But then somewhere along the way, high performance almost became something else, right? Yeah, not from us, but from other people. That this show stood for waking up earlier, working harder, sleeping less, optimizing, never being satisfied.

And I think outside of this show in the real world, we've got to the point when it comes to optimization, where suffering has become something to sell.

So we have to ask ourselves, did we in some small way feed into that narrative that now seems to be everywhere? Because after hundreds of conversations with extraordinary people, I don't think the high performance means now what it once meant to us. So today we're going to explain where we came from, the things that maybe we got wrong, also what we've changed our minds about and what we actually want high performance to stand for in 2026, 2027 and beyond. So we should start by talking about where the idea for this episode came from, right? Because we've been thinking about it for a while, but there was one thing that was a catalyst.

Damian Hughes (2:01)

Yeah, there was a catalyst. It was we stumbled upon Jamie Lang having a conversation with the brilliant comedian Rob Beckett, where Rob expressed his distaste, let's say, for this optimization grindset culture.

Jake Humphrey (2:17)

And named us as part of it. Should we have a listen to the, let's do exactly that, yeah.

Rob Beckett (2:24)

I'll let this one off, because you're nice. Okay. No self-improvement, High Performance or Steven Bartlett optimizing podcast.

Jake Humphrey (2:31)

Eat shit.

Rob Beckett (2:34)

I don't want to be optimized. I want to do as little as possible, for as much money as possible, and go on holiday.

Jake Humphrey (2:44)

So there he is, Rob Beckett being, I mean, hilarious as always, and being great company on Jamie Lange's excellent podcast, which is called Great Company. But the reason why I think we felt compelled to record this episode is that it's hilarious as Rob Beckett is.

And I think none of us would disagree actually with what he said. Like it does feel like there's a real overwhelm of sort of grindset messaging at the moment. But also we feel that where we are these days, we're not actually part of that conversation. So I don't know, maybe he's wrong, maybe we're wrong. And I think it's one for us to explore.

Damian Hughes (3:18)

Well, I like that old Barack Obama quote when he used to say, how can we understand each other if we're just waving our fists? We have to connect. And I think when I heard Rob sort of lumping us in to that category, it made me sort of reflect because when I've read some of Rob's stuff, like he brought a great book out a few years ago where he spoke about his own journey to become a billion comedian, where he was working in a job for an events company and he was gigging two or three gigs a night and working really hard to do it. And then he spoke about how he's had to now protect his mental health from the overwhelm of all these brilliant opportunities.

I really found common ground with him and thought that what he was describing was where we were as a podcast. So I think the fact that Rob doesn't see that is indicative of how so many people sort of would get the messaging wrong. I think the name of the podcast, High Performance, sort of makes people think it's constantly about having to be number one, being the best, constantly being at the top of the charts. Whereas what we've discovered is something very different over that journey.