A Captain's Cup Episode 7: Richie McCaw

SPEAKER_1 (0:01)

A Captain's Cup, the story of the Rugby World Cup, told by the seven men who conquered it. Brought to you by Eden Park. Secure your 2020 membership today.

Welcome to episode seven of A Captain's Cup, an eight part series featuring the seven men who led their country to Rugby World Cup triumph. Throughout these episodes, you'll hear about vivid memories that live on, crucial moments which change tournaments and the feeling when a life's goal is achieved. Brought to you by Radio Sport, Newstalk ZB and the New Zealand Herald, A Captain's Cup.

23rd of October, 2011 and history finally repeats. 24 years on from David Kirk's first ever hoist of the WebAlice Cup, Richie McCaw gets his moment in front of New Zealand and the world. The All Blacks are world champions again and New Zealand celebrates with the men in black who made it happen. A tournament hosted by the eventual champions saw an excruciating finale with the fearless French scrapping till the end. The wait since 87 had featured heartbreak and devastation for New Zealand. The Rugby World Cup proving elusive for the team so often expected to triumph. Richie McCaw had felt the pain of World Cup defeat twice before. He knew how much winning at home would mean. He knew it wouldn't be easy.

This is the story of the 2011 Rugby World Cup. Daniel McHardy is joined by Richie McCaw, a humble leader and ultimate champion. The man who took the All Blacks back to the top. This is A Captain's Cup.

Daniel McHardy (1:54)

Richie McCaw, thank you so much for your time and joining us for the seventh episode of A Captain's Cup. During this series, we've caught up with every World Cup winning captain to find out what has made their campaigns such a success. So it is great to have you on board to round us out. As we have with all the captains, we've tried to ascertain where a successful campaign may have started. And a lot of you, like Nick Farr-Jones, John Eales, Martin Johnson, John Smit, have gone through tournaments where you have actually not won the World Cup.

And most have referenced those experiences as something that they really tried to learn from. So did the experiences of first of the 2003 World Cup, where you are a relatively inexperienced international player and then on to 2007, where you're captain of the side and you're eliminated at the quarter final stage, did they naturally sort of shape your attitude to a World Cup and that of the team for future years?

Richie McCaw (2:50)

Yeah, no, they did, a lot. I think the 3 one was a lot around just the young fella turning up thinking, oh, you just turn up and play.

And you're gonna win. But you find out pretty quickly, that's a bit different to that when it comes to World Cups. And then obviously 07, when you're in charge, it gives you another lesson, which is when the heat comes on, you need to have the answers.

Daniel McHardy (3:20)

2007, you'd won something like 19 of 20 games prior to the tournament, but you lose the quarterfinal. You obviously don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

So was it more privately you really had to sort of critique each other behind closed doors?

Richie McCaw (3:38)

Yeah, I think the difference from you go from 3 to 7 is you have a new set of coaches, and you sort of go, well, that wasn't our team. We're a new team now, and even though the players are the same, you sort of, you don't even acknowledge that you came up short. And I think that's pretty much what happened, perhaps from 99 to 03, then 3 to 7

But the change from 7 on was actually it was the same coaches, same captain, a lot of the same senior players. So you actually did start to reflect on perhaps what it takes to win a World Cup. And it's not the same as what happens in every other game. As much as you try and convince yourself of that, it's different. You get every team at their peak, and there's a bit more pressure.

And that's probably the biggest difference.

Daniel McHardy (4:36)

Of course, the 2007 quarterfinal was a rather controversial one. The refereeing was much discussed, even to this day in some quarters.

To the credit of your own side, you never lamented that publicly. You never offered too many excuses. I'm not sure if you obsessed over that game as much as your coach, Graham Henry, did. I think he's been on record as saying he's watched it countless times. Was that reasonably easy to let go of or was it more important for you to sort of compartmentalise and pick apart your own campaign for the betterment of future Test Matches, future World Cup campaigns?