#962 - Jocko Willink

Joe Rogan (0:08)

Four, three, two.

Welcome back, Jocko. What's happening, baby?

Jocko Willink (0:13)

It's good to be here.

Joe Rogan (0:14)

It's good to see you, man. We were just talking about Chris Cornell. We found out last night at the comedy store that he died, and then this morning found out that he hung himself. Just, fuck.

Jocko Willink (0:27)

It's hard to even comprehend. How do you comprehend that?

Joe Rogan (0:30)

I'm living in a parallel universe. It doesn't make any sense. Like, how could someone like, you know, it's easy on the outside, looking in at a guy like that, and be like, that guy was one of the best ever. Like, how does a guy like that even want to kill himself? How does the lead singer of Soundgarden?

Jocko Willink (0:46)

To me, it just really kind of reveals the complexities of human life.

Yeah. Exactly what you're saying. To have a guy that is at the pinnacle of his skill, the pinnacle of fame, the pinnacle of money, and for him to say, you know what, not gonna do it anymore.

Joe Rogan (1:05)

Yeah, I don't know what was going on in his head, obviously.

Who knows if he was on medication, if he had some sort of an issue, a health issue. Who knows? I mean, I would never speculate, but it just, I don't understand. I mean, again, I don't know his life, but I couldn't even comprehend it. I can't even imagine it.

Jocko Willink (1:23)

Well, that's one of the really hard things when you start talking about suicide for people that, for someone like me, and I haven't had suicidal thoughts, right? So when you go from that to somebody that not only has the thoughts, but then goes ahead and executes it, it's very hard to comprehend.

Joe Rogan (1:41)

Yeah, I've met people that have done it before. I've had a few friends that have done it. I just have never understood it. I don't get it, but I don't know them. I mean, everybody's got their own unique mindset. And it's just, you know what's really crazy, man? I read the statistic the other day about suicide, that people in poor neighborhoods are far less likely to kill themselves.

People that are in the struggle.

Jocko Willink (2:06)

Yeah, well, I actually believe that because they're fighting for something.

Joe Rogan (2:09)

Yeah.

Jocko Willink (2:10)

And someone that's already got everything, and then they end up with no drive, with no goal, and nothing left to achieve. And so then all of a sudden, they're just staring at the mirror without anywhere else to go.

Joe Rogan (2:22)

You know, and I'm not talking about Chris Cornell in particular, but for some people, I know one of the things that happens is that when they become very successful and they're still not happy, then they get hopeless. They just feel like, well, I have everything, and yet I'm fucking miserable. You know, I have a nice big house, I drive this fancy car, and I still am miserable. Like, there's no hope. Like, this life is meaningless.

Jocko Willink (2:48)

I don't even know what to say to that.

Joe Rogan (2:49)

I don't know what to say to that either.

Jocko Willink (2:50)

To be honest with you, when you hear that, you just don't even know what to say to that.

Joe Rogan (2:54)

You know one thing that, why I don't understand it? I like struggle.

I like it. I think it's important.

Jocko Willink (3:01)

No, there's no doubt about that. There's no doubt about having something that you're striving for, some goal. And like you just said, when all those goals have been achieved, and now you're sitting there at the top of the mountain, and now you don't feel happy, what do you do?

Joe Rogan (3:12)

Just pick up a fucking hobby, man.

Find something you suck at and get better at it. I mean, that seems so simplistic. But you know, I just, you and I, we share this very important part of our lives, which is intense exercise.

Jocko Willink (3:28)

Indeed.

Joe Rogan (3:28)

And I think that, you know, I go to your Instagram almost every day to look at your watch.

It's hilarious, if you go to Jocko's Instagram, it's a fucking Timex watch advertisement. It's all just that Iron Man watch with 4.3 in the morning, the occasional 3.30, this motherfucker's up at 3.30.

And you know, and you working out, like that's, his fucking hairy gorilla arm and a Timex Iron Man triathlon watch. But that's what's up, man, that's what's up. I mean, just fucking doing it, getting out there and struggling. And then once you do do that, here's the thing, like, you know, like a friend of mine said that, like I was saying something about you coming on the podcast and he goes, can that dude take another picture of his fucking watch? I go, I hope he takes a picture of his watch every day until he dies. I go, it's important, it's important, it's sort of in a lot of ways, it's symbolic of what we're talking about. Like, no, it's not fun to look at your watch every day, but you're fucking doing it every day. Like that's what's important.