#835 - Louis Theroux

Joe Rogan (0:00)

Yeah, we feel professional with headsets on.

And we're live. Welcome back, Louis.

Louis Theroux (0:06)

Oh, thanks. Nice to be back.

Joe Rogan (0:09)

I was saying before the podcast started that you sent me down a Scientology rabbit hole last night, my friend. I've been down those before, but last night, knowing that you were going to be on and looking forward to it eagerly, I watched a lot of stuff.

Louis Theroux (0:25)

And I spent three years down that rabbit hole, and it's a weird one. It's a weird one. Were you on the Internet? Were you just clicking around?

Joe Rogan (0:34)

Yeah, just...

Louis Theroux (0:35)

There's a lot on YouTube, but there's various very, very well resourced websites. There's one called Clambake.

Joe Rogan (0:42)

I've been to that one, yeah.

Louis Theroux (0:43)

And then there's all the Tony Ortega stuff. I mean, there's just whole worlds. And actually, I mean, I know there's a lot to talk about, but perhaps the biggest obstacle to making a documentary about Scientology is the overabundance of material.

You know, because there's just so many ways to come in on it and you can just chase intriguing leads and then months go by and you're no nearer to filming anything.

Joe Rogan (1:08)

I have a lot of thoughts on this. And one of the thoughts when I was really trying to unpack it all is that I feel like one of the reasons why a lot of these people defend Scientology, I think there's several reasons. One, because it's their team.

And once you become a part of a team, it becomes something that you identify with, it becomes very important to you. And then you wanna defend that. So I think there's that.

But also, I think some people take some benefit in what L. Ron Hubbard created. Because if you, have you read Going Clear?

Louis Theroux (1:43)

Yes.

Joe Rogan (1:44)

When I read Going Clear, I watched the documentary and then I read the book. And one of the things that was more fascinating about the book was the fact that he was essentially trying to diagnose and treat himself.

And he was essentially a really nutty guy.

Louis Theroux (1:57)

He was very damaged.

Joe Rogan (1:59)

Yeah, he had a lot going on. And he was a guy who was trying to sort of sort it out himself and in the process, brought a lot of people in and then created this thing. And some people, they get some benefit from this thing. Because I was watching some of these people that are upset with you, like that woman, there's a trailer where this woman was upset at you because you were in, I haven't seen the documentary yet. It comes out in America in January.

But you were on a road that you had a permit for and she was telling you you were on private land. And I'm looking at this woman, I'm like, this seems like a reasonable, intelligent, assertive, confident woman that would probably, if she didn't get into Scientology, she would have been successful in the corporate world, right?

Louis Theroux (2:46)

I'm sure.

Joe Rogan (2:47)

But here she is, her corporation is written by a nutty science fiction writer who wrote more fiction than any human that's ever walked the face of the planet.

He made up more shit, he wrote down more things that never happened than anyone who's ever lived. And they don't have a problem with that, they're like.

Louis Theroux (3:09)

I mean, you've said about 10 different things that I could break down and analyze. I mean, I basically on the same page as you, I think there's, the first thing to acknowledge about Scientology is that it's a religion and that all religions have a very high portion of, you know, I'm trying to put it politely, but just bogus, fallacious, clearly nonsensical material, right? And Scientology is the same as all of those. I think there's a lot of people who've had, who've derived a lot of benefit from Scientology. I think people probably, there's people whose lives have been saved by it. Kirsty Alley will say at any opportunity that it was Scientology that got her off drugs.

But I think you have to sort of take the whole package. And as far as Hubbard goes, he was an only child. He was a fantasist, a lonely guy who was also a narcissist. And I think as a writer, I mean, you can't, one of the things, intriguing things about Scientology is created by a sci-fi writer, right? There's not, most other religions are created by sort of desert mystics or warriors or people, introspective people. But a modern-day sci-fi writer who's writing things about aliens taken over foreign galaxies, that's really, that accounts for a lot of it's, it's very bizarre inflection, do you know what I mean?