#2357 - Sarko Gergerian

Joe Rogan (0:01)

Joe Rogan Podcast, checking out The Joe Rogan Experience.

SPEAKER_2 (0:06)

Shrink by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.

Joe Rogan (0:12)

What's up, Sarko?

Sarko Gergerian (0:13)

How are you? Hey, how are you, Joe?

Joe Rogan (0:15)

Good to see you.

Sarko Gergerian (0:16)

Oh, it's great to see you. It's great to be here, man.

Joe Rogan (0:18)

How did you meet Paul? So Paul Stamets introduced me to you. Yeah. So how did you meet Paul?

Sarko Gergerian (0:23)

Yeah. So I was aware of Paul for quite some time.

And this past Psychedelic Science, I was shadowing people and working to help the people that went to the conference feel safe, just because of the nature of the environment that we're in now. In what way? So Psychedelic Science had a lot of Jewish practitioners. They had invited Palestinian practitioners in. There was Arab practitioners there. So there was a lot of education around sensitive topics happening. And I was invited in just to be available to help people feel secure.

Joe Rogan (1:07)

What were they worried about?

Sarko Gergerian (1:10)

Any protests building up.

Joe Rogan (1:12)

Just because there was Jewish people and Palestinian people?

Sarko Gergerian (1:15)

Well, the nature of the environment, right? There's wars going on across the world.

Joe Rogan (1:19)

This is a psychedelic conference.

Sarko Gergerian (1:20)

This is a psychedelic conference. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan (1:23)

And they're worried about protests breaking out at psychedelic conferences?

Sarko Gergerian (1:26)

Possible protests, possible people getting overwhelmed with emotion. You know, because in Psychedelic Science 2023, there was a situation where when Rick Doblin was on stage, a group came in and disrupted his presentation, and they were allowed on stage to speak. Oh, boy.

Joe Rogan (1:44)

Right?

Sarko Gergerian (1:44)

But that's a type of disruption, right? And it should be handled carefully.

And Rick handled it like a master.

Joe Rogan (1:51)

What did he do?

Sarko Gergerian (1:53)

He made space for them.

Joe Rogan (1:54)

Oh, well, was that really the way to do it?

Sarko Gergerian (1:56)

Well, it depends. It depends. It depends. There's a time and a place, right? And I think Psychedelic Science 2025 did a wonderful job hearing all the groups that wanted to be there and allowing them to have space to speak from their hearts and minds.

Joe Rogan (2:11)

Why don't you tell everybody what your background is?

Sarko Gergerian (2:13)

Sure. Sure. So I am currently a law enforcement professional at the rank of lieutenant out of Massachusetts. I've been in law...

Joe Rogan (2:23)

You can tell by the accent.

Sarko Gergerian (2:25)

My accent is going to kick in and on and off, on and off through this whole discussion.

Joe Rogan (2:29)

A couple of beers and you really go.

Sarko Gergerian (2:31)

Yeah, yeah, absolutely, absolutely. So that's been about 15 years. I'm also a therapist, a trained psychedelic assistant therapist. And I believe, a lot of people believe, I'm the first law enforcement professional who got a religious exemption at their place of work to access entheogens.

Joe Rogan (2:52)

So how did your journey from being a law enforcement professional to someone who's involved in psychedelics, how did that take place?

Sarko Gergerian (3:00)

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I think I'm going to have to go a little bit further back.

Joe Rogan (3:04)

Oh, sure.

Sarko Gergerian (3:04)

For that, sure. So I went to a little high school in Boston, Massachusetts, Newman Prep. And when I graduated there, I was luckily accepted into Northeastern University. So I go into Northeastern University in my 20s. And they ask you, what do you want to major in? Right. And who knows what they want to major in at that age? I was like, let's study psychology. Right. And get to know myself, figure things out. Such a behavioral program. What I mean by that is rats pressing levers, observable stuff. I wasn't getting what I was looking for. So I take a philosophy class. I take a religion class. Eventually, I take so many of those classes. I graduate with an undergraduate degree in religion and philosophy, and a huge minor in psychology. Right. So I'm a seeker. At that time, as well, Northeastern is a co-op school. So you go to school for six months, you work for six months. I was able to convince my co-op advisor to let me be a security guard in the nightclub industry in Boston for my co-op for school. Okay, so five-year program, I'm studying religion and I'm working as a security guard in the 90s in the nightclub scene in Boston. I have a front row seat when ecstasy hits the scene. I start working when it's high test stimulants and alcohol, and I'm there continuing to work when the scene gets introduced to ecstasy, MDMA.