#179 How to Break Dopamine Addictions with Dr Daniel Lieberman

Daniel Lieberman (0:01)

As health care professionals, we want to prevent problems as much as we can. Preventing is better than curing. And a lot of times we can get people who have not yet hit rock bottom, they've not yet destroyed their lives, and have them pull out of it.

And what's important is that the earlier you catch this illness, the easier it is to treat.

SPEAKER_2 (0:24)

Body, Mind, Empowerment get stronger, faster, smarter, quicker, friendlier, more helpful, more driven.

Siim Land (0:32)

Everything the body needs.

SPEAKER_2 (0:33)

Control your mind.

Siim Land (0:37)

Welcome to the Body, Mind, Empowerment Podcast. I'm your host Siim Land, and our guest today is Dr. Daniel Lieberman. Dr. Lieberman is a psychiatrist and professor at George Washington University. He has published over 50 papers on behavioral science, and has a book called The Molecule of More.

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Daniel Lieberman (1:42)

Thanks so much for having me.

Siim Land (1:44)

Yeah, how did you get into psychiatry and the behavioral sciences? Can you give like a brief background story?

Daniel Lieberman (1:51)

Yeah, sure. You know, when I was in college, I was very interested in philosophy.

And by the time I finished, I sort of decided that the single most interesting thing in the world was the human mind. And that's what led me down the path towards psychiatry.

Siim Land (2:11)

Yeah, it's so true, like the human mind is very mysterious. And we don't really know that much about it.

And it's something like philosophers and scientists have been thinking about for centuries and you know, thousands of years.

Daniel Lieberman (2:24)

Psychiatry is probably the youngest of the medical specialties in terms of the tools we have to approach it from a biological standpoint. And I think that the reason for that is because the brain is so complicated. It's so much more complicated than let's say a kidney or the heart.

And you know, in some ways that makes psychiatry very difficult because we can't make diagnoses by doing blood tests or neuroimaging scans. But on the other hand, it can also be a wonderful thing. And that's because we don't just get laboratory tests on patients. We've got to talk with patients. We're not just focused on the brain. We're also focused on the mind.

And that makes the practice of psychiatry a whole lot of fun.

Siim Land (3:12)

Yeah, yeah, that's so true. Because, you know, as I understand, like there's a difference between the brain in its physical form and the mind in terms of like its psychological aspects. So they're very connected to each other, but they're like somewhat distinct things.

Daniel Lieberman (3:28)

You know, I think that there's really not a whole lot of consensus about what the difference is. Because there are strict materialists who believe that the mind is nothing but the activity of neurons, cells in the brain. If you want to say that the mind is different from the brain, you're kind of taking a leap because you are hypothesizing that there is something there besides atoms and molecules, that there is an additional spiritual component that science is incapable of studying.

It's not necessarily scientific, but I think that it's hard to say that based on our subjective experience, what it feels like to be a human being, to possess a brain, it's hard to say that all there is are atoms and molecules. It feels like we are something more.

Siim Land (4:19)

Yes, it's the body mind dualism is the problem called. And it's definitely like very controversial and something I myself don't know the answer to either. So all the other scientists are also like just speculating almost.

Daniel Lieberman (4:37)

Yeah, I think that's right. You know, scientists tend to be strict materialists, but the general public is not. I think the vast majority of Americans believe in some kind of God, and certainly they believe in a soul.