Sebastian Junger - On Meaning, Mortality, and Belonging

**Sebastian Junger** (0:00)
On our best days as journalists, we're doing something like sacred work. We're bringing information back from Ukraine, from Gaza, from wherever, so that the world can make hopefully a responsible decision about how to protect human dignity. In its ideal form, that's what journalism is, and I've always thought of it that way, right? And so I just thought, okay, I've been going to front lines my whole life. I went to the ultimate front line, which is my own mortality. The mortality we're all going to face. Did I come back with sacred information? Did I come back with anything that will help other people lead their lives and face their mortality with more dignity, with less fear, with more love? Did I or not?

**Ed Roberson** (0:40)
This is the Mountain and Prairie Podcast. I'm Ed Roberson. My guest today is Sebastian Junger. Sebastian is an award-winning journalist, a New York Times bestselling author, and an Academy Award nominated filmmaker. Regular listeners are surely familiar with his work. As I've mentioned his books a ridiculous number of times on this podcast over the years, especially his book Tribe, which has had a lasting influence on how I think about community, purpose, and the kinds of experiences that give people meaning. So for episode 300, I was excited to sit down with Sebastian for a real in-person conversation. Sebastian is the author of The Perfect Storm, War, Tribe, Freedom, and most recently, In My Time of Dying. And he spent decades reporting from war zones and writing about how humans behave under extreme pressure. In this conversation, we started out talking about his early experience on a NOLS course and used that as a jumping-off point to explore a theme that runs through much of his work. Why small groups facing real adversity create such strong bonds, and why those experiences often feel more meaningful than anything in modern, comfortable life. From there, we get into boxing, jujitsu, and the idea that environments with real consequences tend to strip away status and surface-level differences, leaving people to be judged on effort, character, and how they show up for others. We also spend a good amount of time on his most recent powerful book, In My Time of Dying, including the near-death experience that led to it, how he processed it afterwards, and what changed about how he thinks about fear, mortality, and what actually matters in life. We talk about parenting, contentment versus happiness, and how different phases of life demand different kinds of attention and energy. Towards the end, we get into writing, his new Substack project that I highly recommend, smartphones, and why he's chosen to opt out of many versions of modern technology, including social media. This one covers a lot of ground, but it all ties back to a few core questions. What makes a life feel meaningful? What we lose when things get too easy? And how to stay connected to the people around us? We recorded this episode in Aspen, the morning before Sebastian was scheduled to speak at the Aspen Institute. So I'm grateful he took time out of his busy schedule to chat with me. As always, check out the episode notes for a full list of topics and links to everything we discuss. But before we start, I want to take a moment to acknowledge the people and organizations who make Mountain and Prairie possible. As always, the podcast is listener supported through Patreon, and I'm very grateful to everyone who supported the show. It makes a meaningful difference, and it's the financial foundation of this podcast. You can learn more at mountainandprairie.com/patreon. Mountain and Prairie is also supported by a small group of values-aligned organizations on a quarterly or annual basis. A sincere thank you to the Central Grasslands Roadmap, The Nature Conservancy in Colorado, North Bridger Bison, and the Old Salt Co-op. These are all top-notch organizations, and you can learn more about each of them through the links in the episode notes. Today, I want to once again highlight the Central Grasslands Roadmap initiative. One of the things I've come to appreciate more and more over the years is just how important it is to get the right people in the same room. Because when you're dealing with landscapes as big and complex as the Central Grasslands, no single organization or ideology is going to solve anything on its own. And that's where the Central Grasslands Roadmap stands out. At its core, this is a group built around connection. They're constantly bringing together ranchers, land managers, indigenous leaders, scientists, conservation practitioners, and policy makers from across the US., Canada, and Mexico. Not just to talk, but to actually learn from each other and figure out how to move forward in a coordinated way. And they do this in a lot of different ways, through working groups, workshops, conferences, webinars, and on-the-ground gatherings that are all designed to share knowledge, build trust, and keep momentum moving in the right direction. If you're curious about what that looks like in practice, they've got a great page on their website that pulls together many of these opportunities, events, gatherings, and ways to plug into the broader grasslands community. You can find all of that at grasslandsroadmap.org/gather.